Ep. 72: Taste Isn't the AI Moat You Think It Is

0:00:00The boys are back

Play from 0:00:01 8:88:88 0:00:01 What's up, you AI nerds? Fast Hours Podcast, episode 72. Rory Flynn, Drew Brucker Let's go, baby. Let's go. New week. Let's jump this thing off. Rory, talk to me, baby. You know, just winging it, just winging it a little bit. I I like it. I like it. It's uh back to normal, back to chaos, back to new things every day, new new updates, new whatever.

0:00:11Rory recaps Figma Config

Play from 0:00:29 8:88:88 0:00:29 But uh just got back from doing my stint in San Francisco for for Figma Config, which was awesome. Hilario. Like just awesome time. Good seeing some familiar faces. We had Couple friends of the show there and a couple friends from from X there was, you know, hanging out with with Phil Mags, Mindo, saw you know, Linus from from X Linus Eck and Stem if anyone's familiar with him from X.

Play from 0:00:55 8:88:88 0:00:55 So a lot of good people. And just like such a sick event. They they put a they put a lot of effort into it. The thing's huge, man. Like it's so big. The main stage is like a stadium. Like it was like am I at like a tech conference or like a you know, like a Taylor Swift concert here? This thing is massive. But super cool. Had a lot of fun, had a lot of nerves. So it was hoping to not get blasted by people after the facts that the design audience is a little bit different.

Play from 0:01:25 8:88:88 0:01:25 you have that, um I th maybe I saw this somewhere. Maybe you posted it on a story or something, but you had a link to the to the full talk. and I checked it out. Yeah, it was it's really good stuff. Um would highly recommend it. Yeah. I think you crushed it, man. Um that's awesome to see that you you got a chance to do that. It's a big show and um not surprised that you you crushed it either.

Play from 0:01:52 8:88:88 0:01:52 I mean, you've been even doing these talks, so not a surprise at all. Is Luna Luna might be a little Luna might be a little disappointed. She's always she's hot. It's hot today. You know? The they gave me a tough they gave me a tough assignment was basically deep dive into Weavy, but also show like high level practical application and they're like, You have twenty minutes. So it's like lot. You covered a lot in the twenty minutes. You'll appreciate this one.

Play from 0:02:18 8:88:88 0:02:18 We were uh like I knew like it, you know, you get the timer in front of you when you're up there. So like I could see my slides and I could see the timer. So I'm like constantly looking at the timer because I know I gotta like I gotta move. And then I had about probably ten slides left and I saw I had maybe two and a half minutes. I'm like, I gotta go. And I started just like ripping, right? Now, what they do at Figma, which I haven't had before, was there was a like a sign language trend translator nice next to me, like doing it.

Play from 0:02:48 8:88:88 0:02:48 So out of the corner of my eye I see this guy's in like a flow and then like when I start picking up he starts like fucking move moving like uh I so he's doing like interpretive dance over there because I'm moving so fast. He's trying to keep up. And I'm just like sorry dude. Like we we gotta get through this the next two minutes. So I don't I don't know what was what was you know funnier that or my first ride in a Waymo, which I I gotta say changed my changed my opinion on the whole thing.

0:03:13Rory tries Waymo for the first time

Play from 0:03:19 8:88:88 0:03:19 I don't have you ever been in one? I haven't, but now I've got now I've got the the F S D, so yeah. it's crazy. Like I thought there was first off, you know, you see way more stuff. I'm like, okay, there's probably like I'll see a couple. that I guess like you're in the backseat. I mean, and you don't you c it's not like you could just take over the wheel, can you? Like if if an emergency happen yeah.

Play from 0:03:45 8:88:88 0:03:45 No. But I was I like again I went into it I I don't know. I know that Waymo's around. I don't know how around it is. Like I'm thinking I see a couple like every day. It is like all over the place. It's like every other car is one of is is the is like the hub of Waymo's. I I'm pretty sure. So that's probably why. But so you're saying you see in New York quite a bit too, though, right? you don't. I don't think they I don't think they're allowed in New York 'cause it's too crazy.

Play from 0:04:11 8:88:88 0:04:11 But San Francisco seeing them in New York, but I as far as like California, like San Francisco, yeah, that's like I think where they're the most densely populated. Anyway, surreal experience, huh? it took me definitely a couple days to warm up to the idea and then one night when I was I ha I had a couple beverages and uh I was like, All right, I'm doing this 'cause like if there's any other time I'm if there's any time I'm gonna be comfortable with doing it it's now.

Play from 0:04:41 8:88:88 0:04:41 Thing pulls up, I get in and it just starts going and I'm like, yo, I'm like you? Like based on Bluetooth connection, loc pre precise location, and and then what do you like? Do you anybody can open the door? the on the app specifically, it says unlock door. So you click that and it unlocks the door. So then you can just like open it. Yeah. And then uh you know, we took it and or I took it and I was like screaming the whole way back.

Play from 0:05:06 8:88:88 0:05:06 I was like, every time it was like doing something, I didn't trust it at all. Then the next day I was like, Screw up, we're taking this. I took I took Phil with me and you know we went to go get tacos somewhere. But it was like he had the it was like His first time, so he was doing the same thing, like white knuckling the whole way. But the second time, the novelty's already gone. Like now it's like, All right, now this is just cool. It comes, you can play your you can play your music in it, you can sit in the backseat, you can basically just like kinda do whatever you want, and just like hang out the in there and just it's quick, it's fast, it doesn't talk to you, and it's clean.

Play from 0:05:45 8:88:88 0:05:45 And it's like this is this is not bad. No. No one wants to talk. I mean, I I used to kind of I was I was sort of like that walking uh stereotype where you'd be like, hey man, how's it going? How long you been driving Uber? You know? Couple years ago. A couple years ago, it's like, nah, man, I don't even I don't even talk. Hi, how's it going? All right, bye. You know, that's it.

Play from 0:06:10 8:88:88 0:06:10 I had a bad ride with one of my friends one time. And it wasn't me, it was it was them. And uh I got like a like a one-star rating and it ruined my Uber rating for a little bit. So then I was like actively trying to get it back, you know. In New York that's gold, so I had to try. dude, full sales mode back, you know. I'd get in there and start, you know, asking them questions that I knew they were gonna like just want to vent about. And then like that boosted my rating right back up. And I did it in San Francisco, I was like, one guy was asking me something, I'm like, yeah, it's gonna I had to ask you something.

Play from 0:06:39 8:88:88 0:06:39 How much do you hate these Waymo's? It was like 20 minute offloading of of how much he hates them after that five star rating. Yeah. You gotta do it sometimes. You gotta yeah. Cause there is funny situations, right? Like I was at a I was at a restaurant and it was you know, I was walking home, but I walked outside and you know, two lane street, cars parked on both sides.

Play from 0:07:06 8:88:88 0:07:06 So like the Waymo's pull up from both From both sides and they stop and then they were letting people out at the restaurant. And then the cars behind them, you know, they're like trying to turn and like kinda judge what the Waymo's gonna do because they don't know. And then like after the Waymo dropped people off, it sat there for like ten seconds. So then both cars like try to like go around and into like the other lanes. And then like as soon as they were in the other lanes, both Waymo's took off. So it just like you can just tell everyone, it's just like screw these things, man.

Play from 0:07:34 8:88:88 0:07:34 I wanna drive with this. Yeah. By the way, if we've been going on about Waymo and you guys aren't familiar with Waymo, self-driving car in San Francisco, and it's just like there's there's no way you can't take over it. They can't remotely pilot it if it starts doing something. So you're kind of in for kind of in for a little joyride, one way or the other. But it was you know, it's like every it's everyone who's at from out of town taking it for the first time, it's like all anyone could talk about the Waymo, because it's so it's just so ridiculous, you know, it just doesn't make sense.

Play from 0:08:05 8:88:88 0:08:05 It's like this is where we are now. So, you know, config, awesome. Spoke, was cool, was on a little s little stage, you know, walked out, turned the corner, saw like twenty people deep in the back, like flowing out the stage. I was like, this is gonna be different than I thought. I was expecting like really like intimate, like I can sort of interact that, then Waymo, then all the other stuff, summarizing it good time.

Play from 0:08:32 8:88:88 0:08:32 That's all that's all I got to say about that. But yeah, man. Yeah. So we're back though. We're back. I think we did we miss last week or we record no, we missed last week. But t'es pris. last week, but we didn't record last week. Yeah. my week's off too. Yeah. Yeah, it's crazy. If anyone's wondering where we were last week and you didn't see the episode, it's because we got we got dinged a little bit by the you know the the algorithm for for our thumbnail.

0:08:52The algorithm ding

Play from 0:09:02 8:88:88 0:09:02 So if you missed episode seventy one uh it wasn't for the thumbnail. I thought it was for our thumbnail because we had you know the White House and American flag and it said election advertising promotion. You know, it's like seriously? So then, you know, I just I I just changed the thumbnail a couple of times, like, okay, let's remove the the American flag.

Play from 0:09:28 8:88:88 0:09:28 Let's remove the White House, let's remove the red, white, and blue. From the streaks coming from the Jets. And each time is like, nope. So it something in our episode, we are, you know, actively politicking in some direction. So just, just, you know, just so you know. and you know, they'll probably hear this transcript and think that we better be careful. So anyway, I'm gonna move on from that and apologi apologize for any lisps that take.

Play from 0:09:59 8:88:88 0:09:59 place today. I just got Invisline. Today is day one. And uh I'm just YOLOing it. I am raw dogging it straight from Invisline appointment into the episode. Here we are. So ride along with me. We're gonna we're gonna take care of it. And Rory, you know, maybe this is a really good time. Tell your dental hygienist. Tell your dentist.

0:09:59Invisalign enters the chat

Play from 0:10:24 8:88:88 0:10:24 Tell the receptionist at the at the dentist office. Get those guys in to subscribe to this podcast. We need them. We need them. Need this. And we need them. So if you haven't, tell one of them. But Tell em. Yep. We got we got a ton of stuff happening here. You know? I feel I feel like the I feel like we've become like AI sports center.

0:10:41Claude Fable returns nerfed

Play from 0:10:50 8:88:88 0:10:50 So much stuff happens at this point. It's like it's for anyone who for I think we should just cover this quickly because I'm sure a lot of people have been waiting on it. Last week we discussed ad nauseum Fable. The fable situation with the US government and being stripped from everyone's usage in How that's potentially not cool.

Play from 0:11:16 8:88:88 0:11:16 We didn't want it to set a precedent moving forward, but it looks like it's setting a precedent moving forward. And for anyone who just got fable access back yesterday or today, depending on where you are, it's nerfed. And it's and it's nerfed pretty bad. Like it's not it's not easily not the same model. But we saw that the US government can come in and just say, like, okay, you know, we don't want you, we we want to use this model. Our way, but you as the consumer can't use it because it's dangerous, which there's merit to that.

Play from 0:11:47 8:88:88 0:11:47 But also, I think you know, now that they can do that with this model, you saw the like open AI has to do it like a very specific way. Mm-hmm. And now it's uh the only people that don't feast off this is us, like the people that are using it. So we're the ones that are gonna be caught holding the bag, paying $200 a month, getting nerfed models, right? So I think it's just good to note to mention that if you want a longer diatribe on it.

Play from 0:12:14 8:88:88 0:12:14 We talked about it a lot last week. But that was I was disappointed. I don't know if you got to use it yet. just like since it's been back, j I mean, just a little bit this morning. Um it's been a it's been a crazy week. I'm just playing catch up. I was out last week too. um Getting this car. There's an Invisalign. I'm like changing my whole life right now this week.

Play from 0:12:40 8:88:88 0:12:40 Um, but I'm ex I'm taking the uh my girls to their first baseball game tonight. Cardinals are in town playing the Braves. Uh series cap. Yeah, it is gonna be hot. it's like 97 here today, uh, with humidity. So, you know, it's brutal. Um, but I'm excited for that. I've been like I I wanted to take them last year. And I sort of regretted not taking them.

Play from 0:13:05 8:88:88 0:13:05 I mean, I was really thinking about it, but I I am glad that I waited. I think they're gonna appreciate it much more now. Um, they love watching sports, man. They they watched part of the the World Cup games with me. They were watching the Rams last year. You know, we watched some Cardinals this week because it was just on, you know, um regular channels because they're local. You know, it's like, all right, this will be fun. This'll be fun. But yeah, man, it it It it's been yeah, it's just interesting.

0:13:32AI regulation gets messy

Play from 0:13:36 8:88:88 0:13:36 I like I don't know what else to say about this other than the fact that like the precedence has been laid now with now that it's happened once, what is the process going to be moving forward for new models? Do all new models need to be approved by the government now? and is there a conflict of interest in the sense that you've got this deal now with OpenAI and the government? You know, like anyway, we better watch what we say about getting too far into.

Play from 0:14:02 8:88:88 0:14:02 The POL. But I'm just I'm just thinking that like that that's a weird thing to throw in the mix as well. and yeah, it's just gonna be really interesting to see how this plays out. Does that slow the velocity? Does that do they really start to create this delta, which probably already exists, right? We just don't know it. But does the delta become wider between people that are higher up in certain positions, working for certain People, certain brands and companies, um, organizations, entities, versus like the everyday person like us.

Play from 0:14:40 8:88:88 0:14:40 What is that delta like in terms of the capabilities, right, that these models have? And I just feel like is that going to grow as well? Right? The difference between the power that's involved on one side of that model versus the other side of that user model. And it's just interesting, man. I don't I don't like it, but also like there there's a big thing going on here in general, which is very concerning, right? Which is the whole Tech has been this tech specifically has been moving so much faster than regulations since day zero.

Play from 0:15:14 8:88:88 0:15:14 And now we're at a point several years in where it seems like that's going to start to tighten up a little bit. But it's a real interesting situation that you've got this arms race happening with AI between people like China and the USA, right? And you're trying to balance speed. And win this race with safety.

Play from 0:15:41 8:88:88 0:15:41 And those things don't typically w, you know, mix very well in a competitive environment. So I just there's a big thing there, man. And um, yeah, I I don't know exactly what my specific concern is at this time, but there are several that are just kind of lurking in the back of my brain where I'm just like, Yeah, this, this, this feels weird. I don't, I don't like this, but Definitely doesn't feel doesn't feel great.

Play from 0:16:08 8:88:88 0:16:08 But this is like I always like to pull this up just to make sure that you know, we're still operating on a lesser model, which is if you can tell, you know, cloud government seems to never be out. Always working at uh, you know, full capacity. Meanwhile, uh I mean it's it's if you look at it from, you know, all the way back to May, I think when they were there was probably the I forget when the first sort of like collaboration news was and then it's like ever since then always always operational but it kind of you know it it feels like it feels like we were sort of like raising uh livestock for for slaughter it was like let's just let you know the consumers pay for all of it and then when it's good enough we'll just take it.

Play from 0:16:50 8:88:88 0:16:50 That's kind of how it feels. and I was worried about this and I was worried about how bad it would be when we got it back. It looks like it's delegating a lot of tasks to you know, Opus four point eight, which yesterday I wanted to almost just quit Claude. It just couldn't get something so simple and you know, I had to go back to four point six to get something to work. And then Fable came out and did it in five seconds, which it wasn't hard to begin with. But it was Yeah, it's feels weird.

Play from 0:17:17 8:88:88 0:17:17 It feels like that's the new pr like again, it's like, we're gonna have like all this stuff for like, you know, the top hundred trusted partners. They're gonna get the good stuff and then we're gonna have to make make, you know It's just a dude, I mean, there's there's so many things at play here. I mean, you think of too who's leading these organizations, open AI, anthropic, you know, things that they have set up in terms of um I don't know if morality is the right word.

Play from 0:17:48 8:88:88 0:17:48 Um, although it could be applied here. But you know, it's just this this is going to this has The looks of something that is going to eat lunches of other brands, just like Amazon did, right? Where it kind of finagled its way in the back door of all these places and got enough data and information and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah to just eat lunches and take over.

Play from 0:18:14 8:88:88 0:18:14 Right. It's a helpful tool for a brand and a company or an entity until it knows exactly everything that it does and now it can do it. that's, I mean, that's. Palantir guy, did you see that interview? The carp? I of course that's like one of the things I I bookmarked but haven't um listened to. But um I think it was along those same lines.

Play from 0:18:41 8:88:88 0:18:41 Yeah. Okay. was it. It was just basically like they're taking all the IP. Like that's what they're they're just data collection on the IP and that's a yeah. I you know, because it's it's almost you have to use these tools now. I mean and so you've got the stickiness there, the inevitability there. You know, I don't know. There's gonna be some some some th some things we even talk about today, um, that it's like, oh, that that affects how how I'm gonna, you know, productize or um package, you know, services for my clients.

0:18:44AI tools and IP risk

Play from 0:19:19 8:88:88 0:19:19 You know, like there they're just there are things that are competing against you and me, even, right? Um so it's something that we all, you know, need to be aware of. And I think this is a really good point to start. being proactive about the way that we're thinking about those things and how it applies to us. Because that's what you know, we talked about this several times on the podcast. Like every couple months, there's something that changes the way that we might package that offering or deliver that output or, you know, chain tools together or capabilities, right?

Play from 0:19:51 8:88:88 0:19:51 Where it's like we have to be kind of continuously playing and being curious and experimenting because something can come along and it's like, sh well, okay. Like my livelihood, maybe I was able to charge this much for this kind of service and now that's commoditized or democratized in a sense where it's like, well, this is gonna die soon. So what do I do about it? Who knows? We'll be on sh we'll be on, you know, distilled, you know, dumber models for everyone else is getting to operate, so surprised if that's the approach where they get ahead.

Play from 0:20:27 8:88:88 0:20:27 So they start getting models, they being the powers that be, start getting access to models one or two versions ahead of what's currently publicly available. Um, or they're just entirely different models, period. Um, that's also the the other thing. But um, you know, because there's gotta be some sort of uh I guess regulation now with with understanding what the capabilities are and not just taking those things at word um from the providers.

Play from 0:20:55 8:88:88 0:20:55 And I'm sure they're not gonna wanna do what they just did where it's like they release it and then week or two goes by and then they gotta take it off the shelf. Well, I also just found out that I d I didn't realize that like clawed enterprise is basically API pricing per user. So it's not like subs it's not like monthly subscription token allotment. It's like every time you hit it, it's just a f you know, flat price.

Play from 0:21:21 8:88:88 0:21:21 Every time you hit the button, and that's why some of these companies are spending like five hundred million dollars a month in tokens. Which to me, I had this conversation with Phil. It like Is that not the easiest enterprise sales job in the world? What do you have to sell? You just get on the phone and say, How many seats do you want? And like that's it. It the product already sold itself. You don't have to do anything. compoundingly easier too, because you no longer have to educate on the value of doing it, you know, or the use cases even.

Play from 0:21:50 8:88:88 0:21:50 People have inevitably seen those things and larger quantities and different demographics, different verticals now. You know, I mean, there's still some antiquated spaces, obviously. But yeah, I mean, it's kinda like, you know, what we're doing selling our services at the beginning. We had to educate people on exactly what the hell we're doing, number one. And two, why why someone would pay for that.

Play from 0:22:16 8:88:88 0:22:16 You know, we had to really explain the ROI of those things. Everybody get that now. I mean, you we don't we don't have to really sell that. but same thing, same thing. I mean, for them, yeah, that would that would be money. They would hey, sales roll. Let's go. Let's let's jump back in. I mean, dude, look the other the other thing was uh I did see your post on I think it was either X or LinkedIn about the taste as the moat.

0:22:33Taste as a moat gets challenged

Play from 0:22:43 8:88:88 0:22:43 I thought that was that was well well crafted. And something that I had felt internally like, I don't know, a year ago. And I was like that that's why I need to get out of this. Right? Like I need to move, right? I need to we were, and I'm not gonna say that we invented the stance on this, but I I remember being very, very early about us talking taste being emote. I mean, we were talking about that years ago.

Play from 0:23:10 8:88:88 0:23:10 Um, and now it's a very common thing that people are posting about. I'm just like, yeah, that would have been a great post a year ago. People know this shit now. And I yeah, so the post. That I put out on LinkedIn yesterday, I think I put maybe a shorter version out on X, which was just about the idea that like you can't keep relying on taste being the moat. It's gonna dry up faster than people think. I think taste will inevitably still have a role in the process.

Play from 0:23:38 8:88:88 0:23:38 But I think a lot of it, a lot of the manual pieces of that can be automated with the right context, right? I mean, it's just like brand guidelines. Like if you give it the things that exactly Are the tastes that fit you or it's defined taste like in photography, for example, there are objective things that make better photos. Proper lighting, proper composite like if you're doing something with uh the rule of thirds or you know you know, any of these sort of compositions, that's automatically a better photograph.

Play from 0:24:14 8:88:88 0:24:14 Right. So you could apply objective pieces and codify that for taste. Right. Now I I think the other thing I'm one thing I'm gonna post about today is I do or maybe maybe this isn't today. Um but I I was sort of sourcing through this too. Yesterday when I did make that post, I like what taste itself is a large category. Are there subcategories of taste? So I started going down that. Like what are the different kinds of taste?

Play from 0:24:41 8:88:88 0:24:41 Um, because I think like right. Right. But you know what I mean? Like, because it it is a big, it's a it's like a very big bucket of things. So I think like, um, let me see if I can kind of found find what I I landed on here. Um Let's see. Yeah, like, okay. So stylistic taste.

0:25:02Breaking down types of taste

Play from 0:25:07 8:88:88 0:25:07 Think about things like color grading, colors, composition, texture, lighting, right? Kind of what I was just mentioning. There are certain things there that that's not really much of a durability, you know, for taste. Um, whereas something like strategic taste or moral taste, strategic being like connecting creative decisions, um To your audience or business outcomes.

Play from 0:25:32 8:88:88 0:25:32 Or um morality maybe is what kind of things deserve attention from your brand. but I think there's like this gap, there's a spectrum there, right? Where those feel like there's an e a a longer durability to the taste. But a couple of these other ones I'll just kind of point out. So stylistic taste, selection taste. So kind of like being able to pick the the winners, right? So again, if we're creating You know, 20 images with the same prompt.

Play from 0:25:59 8:88:88 0:25:59 How do we pick the one or two images we're ultimately going to select for a campaign or a project? Okay. Then you got something that I would I was calling sort of like editorial taste, which is like knowing what to include and what not to include, right? The do's, the don'ts, all that. Um, then I was thinking about okay, like there's taste in concepts, conceptual taste, right? So you think about finding the right idea.

Play from 0:26:26 8:88:88 0:26:26 metaphor, tension, the communication, um, or even the framing of the image, right? Then I think you get to something that's probably a little bit more niche, which would be like cultural taste, right? You've got culture at a wide general level. So thinking about that like in terms of like countries, but you can also get that down to niches, you know, subregions of a country, um, niches within that based on affinity or hobbies or, you know, whatever those things are.

Play from 0:26:56 8:88:88 0:26:56 And then I think getting into like the strategic moral taste. I'm not, I haven't sort of like completely made that concrete, but I I was just trying to like break those things down because taste is a big bucket. And I think if I I communicate that taste is drying up largely just as a whole, I'm gonna get some pushback on that because it taste means different things to different people. And so I was trying to like kind of like extrapolate that out a little bit and kind of See what those subsets are.

Play from 0:27:24 8:88:88 0:27:24 But I I do. I I think, you know, taste in general, um, again, like there are some objective things that can be solved right away. And some of those different tiers of taste are gonna be much more durable than others. Right. And so we're already seeing that, right? Like the taste conversation has become like the AI will not take your job conversation. Right?

0:27:40Timing, novelty, and AI trends

Play from 0:27:49 8:88:88 0:27:49 Like it's like it's like the same comment. It's like people who use people who use AI will take your job. It's not like you have to have taste. It's like, yeah, guys, like everyone figures like everyone knows that. Like it's it's like I just don't I don't understand like the first off, it's so shallow, like you said, to say taste. It's like ambiguous. It's like, you know, it's like again, there's it it it w w what is that what does that actually mean?

Play from 0:28:18 8:88:88 0:28:18 But also like for something to be successful, it could also have good taste. But at the same time, like taste uh needs other factors to make this whole thing work. Like you have to have timing. You have to have sort of connectivity with your brand or message. It also has to have like, you know, it novelty factor. it like I can have the best taste in the world, but if everyone's seen it a million times, they don't care anymore. Right? Like it's the same thing. Like it it's like how like the novelty factor of like the Y2K sort of imagery set, right?

Play from 0:28:48 8:88:88 0:28:48 That everyone like jumps towards like, every brand needs to go back to this Y2K aesthetic, right? Like this sort of low angle, you know, distorted bodies, like you know, hyper saturation, hyper real, you know, funky positions, crazy hair, crazy colors, right? Like That's cool when you see it for the first month or two, but now after doing it it's like I've seen it ten thousand times. Good taste, wrong time. Right? Like it it's Yeah.

Play from 0:29:17 8:88:88 0:29:17 little point. Um, because Trends are faster than ever now. And the the capability to act on the trends, the bar is at the floor. So to your point, the Y2K aesthetic, I mean, you could see 10 people do that overnight. So what makes yours different?

Play from 0:29:43 8:88:88 0:29:43 Like you're you're gonna need to be thinking about, you know, um, you're you're gonna need to be fluid. And and I think like now more than ever, it's important to set. to try to set the trend versus jumping into the trend. Um by the time that you jump in, it's already saturated. I mean, for sure. I mean, this is an old example, but remember you remember this. Remember the, remember the figurines in the package?

0:29:53Trend cycles hit warp speed

Play from 0:30:11 8:88:88 0:30:11 Yeah. yeah. Okay. Um, I think I saw that and then I uh you know, I was in house somewhere at that time and um I created some of those like figures for like our our C suite to post on social, like right away, like within twenty-four hours of that. And we did. Got really good engagement on it, great. But then you started to see that whole tail, right?

Play from 0:30:37 8:88:88 0:30:37 Of everybody doing it, and then it just You know, just falling off a cr you saw people do it two weeks after. It's like, dude, what are you doing? Why are you even posting this anymore? Um, but that that that's what we're talking about though. I mean, you gotta yeah, I think it's it's important to be versatile, to be unique, you know, and and try to set the trends. I mean, I don't know that that's like an actual actionable strategy to try to set the trend, but I think like you need to be thinking different.

Play from 0:31:03 8:88:88 0:31:03 You need to be maybe even leveraging creativity in a different way, you know, in that sense. I think maybe that's an interesting thing to be thinking about as well. But Think it's gonna be hard for brands moving forward, really hard. Cause I feel like this is a probably more of a you know expertise question for you. But I feel like to have a strong brand, you're gonna have to have a unique look. And a seemingly unique look is gonna become more homogenized and like everyone can do it.

0:31:12AI slop can damage brands

Play from 0:31:29 8:88:88 0:31:29 And like you saw everyone get away with it over the last twenty years. Yeah. You like that word? Big one. SAT word. But it's like you know how like everything started to look exactly the same? Like when it like, you go on why is everything a pastel color with, you know, rounded soft edges? Like why does everything look like that? Like every product was doing that same type of marketing and like it's not a brand, it was just a trend, but everyone's brand sort of mimicked that at that point. And it's like, Okay, this all looks the same.

Play from 0:31:56 8:88:88 0:31:56 I don't know what the difference is between your lipstick and your lipstick. Like, who cares? So it's yeah. That's what I mean. Yeah. you know, you okay, practical example here. Just people writing on I would say LinkedIn is probably the worst with this, but I mean X is pretty bad too. But you know, it's just it's clear and obvious AI writing. Even the comments, you know, and just like I I did this to a couple people yesterday commented on my stuff.

Play from 0:32:25 8:88:88 0:32:25 I mean, to me, it's like I can see it so obviously. I'm just like, But what do you think? Yeah. Well exactly, that's exactly answers both times I did that. But but I think like to be to be fair though, anybody that's established any sort of following on these social channels but then is using that in that way. And that could be text. I think it even big extends into video scripts. I mean, those are bad too. Um they're guilty of you can tell when they do it.

Play from 0:32:51 8:88:88 0:32:51 You know, it's like three questions in a row, um, three examples in a row. No, you know, like yeah, I got all those patterns down. But anyway, um, but that that cheapens. I when I see that, that affects my my vision of you or a brand. And I think the same can be said with the example that you gave with the white two. Like, if you're not first and you're doing something that people have seen time and time again, I don't think highly of you as a brand.

Play from 0:33:19 8:88:88 0:33:19 That makes me think of you slightly differently. I don't see people talking about that either. But like that is a problem. That is a major problem that I don't think a lot of people are paying attention to. You're putting your reputation on one of the hardest things to build, but the easiest to tear down. I mean, so I I think that's that should be giving people pause as well. It definitely deserves a proactive approach to the way that you're thinking about it, whether you're a person or your brand.

Play from 0:33:46 8:88:88 0:33:46 Yeah, I think there's a lot of things that should be left in the hands of AI. I think there's a lot of things that probably shouldn't. I don't think brand building necessarily from like an ethos standpoint is is well handled. Like that has to come from community and sort of like shared experience of your customers, which is tough, right? Like that's one of the best brands in the world. There's not there's not a million of them, right? There's like a hundred. Like that, you know, we can recognize a lot of them, but they've done a lot of work over a long time to have that.

Play from 0:34:16 8:88:88 0:34:16 That view. You don't just get that overnight. But to me, it's just like I'm so tired of some of these con it's it feels like such low hanging fruit again. Like again, it feels exactly like the, you know, AI is not going to replace you. Someone who knows AI is going to replace you. It's like taste is the mode. It's like, it's just like, yeah, like timing also comes into this. Like I, you know, and again, people also don't know what taste was a lot of times until after the fact. Like, how many times? Like I was just showing you the I was just showing you the this little I'll pull it up for everyone.

0:34:45Vintage aesthetics and timing

Play from 0:34:46 8:88:88 0:34:46 I have like this little mood board of like nineteen eighties, uh like nineteen eighties car dashboards and stuff. And like Yeah. I may maybe I don't know. I pulled them from Pinterest. Pinterest. Right? Like you look at those the people in the back in the day that red one eighty five one. Whereas that one, right? Like how it feels like you're in like Star Wars blasting off.

Play from 0:35:13 8:88:88 0:35:13 Like I to me, like these types of graphics, probably people by the time they had seen in every single car, they're like, This is awful. Like I j I don't want this anymore. And now like I look at this and be this is the coolest thing I've ever seen. Right? Like, you know what I mean? So it's like timing wise, probably, you know, some of the stuff could be Yeah. Yeah. kinda like fashion, maybe in that sense. D well, fashion always comes back because there's always a previous inspiration. Like I like people that do a lot of like vintage stuff that like take the modern approach to it.

Play from 0:35:42 8:88:88 0:35:42 They like pull from the history so you feel something, like I connected to it, but then also like let me see what you do with it. Cause, you know, there's something to being original, but original is extremely hard. Um, you know, and I'd rather see a I'd rather see like a aesthetic that's like I have some sort of connection to, like from whenever, and then like a put a modern take on it. And this is my own personal opinion, versus like Here's a new UX UI design trend, liquid glass.

Play from 0:36:08 8:88:88 0:36:08 Let's have everyone do it. It's like I just learned about it and now I don't like it anymore. You know what I mean? Because it's like I've just seen it too much and everyone's like, this is the best thing ever. Let's just do it. you know, so it's it's an interesting conversation. It could have probably a six-hour discussion on it because I I mean, I know we don't we don't do much of this on here guy, but this one just like I think you start to get to an irk point when it's like every scroll it's the same exact thing and you're like, All right, every is everyone writing with AI and they're just reading all of the posts and then regurgitating the most trending topic 'cause it's what it starts to sound like.

Play from 0:36:43 8:88:88 0:36:43 it's frustrating. like how much of what we're putting in is getting reused into training data sets. Because there, like, I'm sure you've definitely experienced this, but it makes you feel in some ways like a visionary because there are so many things I've talked about that I had never heard about before, never seen discussed, that a couple months go by.

Play from 0:37:12 8:88:88 0:37:12 Other people are saying the same thing. And as much as I'd like to feel and and call myself an oracle in that regard, I just feel like some of this information is getting regurgitated in and sort of like pushed around, you know? Like taste is the moat. What taste is the moat specifically. That line, right, has you know, so it's just like I I get there's the sort of um waterfall effect of people saying and then other people climbing onto it.

Play from 0:37:43 8:88:88 0:37:43 But this feels like wider than that. And I again I'm sure I am positive that there are some people on this podcast listening to this and you have experiences personally where you've maybe come to the conclusion on some things or you've discovered something. It felt like you've discovered something new or you know somewhat original or um perhaps like a just different complete thought about something that maybe even is contrary. And then you just all of a sudden start seeing it pop up.

Play from 0:38:11 8:88:88 0:38:11 Yours is the first one in a long time where I clicked on it, 'cause I click on most of them just to see if anyone has like a unique take. And it's the same take every time. Like why does why does your regurgitated take that's been said ten thousand times, like, make any sense? 'Cause you had a fresh perspective on it, which is nice, right? Like it's nice to see someone take that con. and against what we're what we've been talking about. Like I mean you were the biggest proponents of taste is the moat.

Play from 0:38:37 8:88:88 0:38:37 Now I'm on the other side of it. Like y yes. Like How do you engineer that at scale? How do you actually take your taste and apply it in a bigger way versus just like you have to be able to get taste? It's like, okay. Like go study for a day, you'll figure out some taste. Yeah, somebody somebody said too in the comments, they're like, well, you know, someone still has to own the call when a campaign flops or something happens or um something goes wrong or this and that and the other.

0:38:37Taste needs systems now

Play from 0:39:07 8:88:88 0:39:07 I'm like, yeah. So I mean, what are you saying? Like taste can't, you know, be solved in that regard because someone's got to be responsible. You know, because I like I was just thinking, the perfect example now that you and I are driving these. you know, new cars that we got, you know, uh I picked up, you know, my CyberTruck the other day, did full uh FSD. Never experienced that before.

Play from 0:39:32 8:88:88 0:39:32 But guess what happens, right? Like, even though that's controlling the vehicle, if I got in an accident, had a collision, whose fault's that? It's still mine. So that to me, right, like even if your hands aren't guiding turns or your feet aren't pushing pedals, you're still responsible. So I think like taste is there there's gonna be manual parts of that and and the responsibility will still go back on whoever's setting those things up.

Play from 0:40:02 8:88:88 0:40:02 So I I don't think that's like a rational argument in that sense. Like I don't I don't I don't see how that would prevent taste from being solved in a in uh a general regard, but Yeah. I mean, we're gonna have to evolve taste. Like taste is gonna have to evolve. Like I'm I'm I'm seeing it, you see it from certain people. We're not saying taste is gone because of AI. I've seen a lot of people that have really explored unique visual stuff that's not possible, you know, f a year and a half ago.

0:40:14Evolving visual taste

Play from 0:40:31 8:88:88 0:40:31 Right? It's like that's cool. That's the medium that I think is going to win is like this very unique setting. I think of, you know, people like Blacklight and things like that who just have like this unique like Very them, but also very like it's a brand. Like their own look is their brand and they keep it going and they they keep producing different stuff that looks that looks nothing like what we've seen before. Right?

Play from 0:40:56 8:88:88 0:40:56 So you know the unfortunate thing is that uh marketing is a game of marketing is a game of parroting what works best and just driving home return. So like to be in marketing right now at a brand new company? I I I mean I don't know. It's probably easier than ever and harder never at the same time. Yeah. figure out what actually works? I mean, like honestly, it's like distr distribution.

Play from 0:41:23 8:88:88 0:41:23 I like taste is not, I don't even think I mean, maybe more on the direct to consumer side, but Hold on. This is this is incredible. Well, let me see like it I I didn't mean to cut you off there, but I just remembered that I saved a post from the other day. I'm just spitballing here. I just like these are all things that are just rattling around. Let me see if I can find this post because I thought this is this is the best example of what we're talking about.

Play from 0:41:54 8:88:88 0:41:54 let me see if Where's the saved post? Come on. But no. How long ago was this? not save it. It's killing me that I if I didn't do this. Alright, so there just to just to try and summarize it, I thought I saved this post, but it was just a guy and he said this is my highest performing ad creative I've ever had.

Play from 0:42:22 8:88:88 0:42:22 And it was just a a picture of his product in a white box and he hand drew with like my like it looked like Microsoft paint like the text in there. The text is so illegible and like all over the place. And he's like this is By far and away, nothing even comes close with post of the statistics. And I'm like, because again, it's so novel that it it's just like here's not like the perfect Canva template ad, right? It's like here's it's a it's an a sore thumb.

Play from 0:42:49 8:88:88 0:42:49 Like Right? But like we look at the Microsoft Paint stuff again. And like me, I'm like, I love this. You know, like the aesthetic like the the like the rainbow aesthetic thing or the star the like the word shooting across the stars, you know, that that meme or whatever. And you're like, it's great because it feels like something I know also applied in a funny way. Um it just again, taste is who would look at that and say, I think the best example I have for taste is South Park.

Play from 0:43:17 8:88:88 0:43:17 you know, for anyone who's not familiar. with South Park, longest running television show in American history. And yeah, it's the longest running, longest running. I think it's only I th it's either that or the WWF or WWE, whatever it is now. but if anyone has looked at that as those aesthetics, you would not go and say that's beautiful or that's well crafted or that's well done. It's like It's the story and the way that they tell it and the novelty of it.

0:43:19South Park and imperfect taste

Play from 0:43:45 8:88:88 0:43:45 And because it's illustrated, you can do whatever you want so they can make it as ridiculous as they want, which is why people like it. You know, so it's like it doesn't have to look like Pixar. It can look like South Park. But if it's if it's good, it connects with the audience, it's directionally correct, it's at the right time, which they are able to turn things around in a week. They get piece of news, they write a creative story about it, it's out in seven days, right? Like timing.

Play from 0:44:10 8:88:88 0:44:10 works. Like it's not they don't do that five years later when no one cares. Right. So it's it to me it's just there's so much that that's baked into it. Again, I would never look at South Park and say like if I had never seen the show in a vacuum, right? And say this is taste. It's like this is ta it's like I get it. I get it. And and I thought you brought up like a really interesting thing too, which is the imperfection, right? Um, you know, just you brought up that.

Play from 0:44:38 8:88:88 0:44:38 You also brought up Pixar. Whenever I see anything that looks like Pixar now, my appreciation for what it looks like has diminished so much. Right. Um fun anymore because it's just the same. Like you want to see something that's different. Mm-hmm. now, right? So yeah, it's uh I mean technically you could do it South Park too. But like I guess the the point is there even in that show, and it's been a long time since I seen it.

Play from 0:45:06 8:88:88 0:45:06 Used to watch it all the time as a kid, but um there was always tie ins to pop culture, you know. Um which I think is also important. But again, the it's a it's it's in its own unique lane. There's nothing really like South Park. No. and it's kind of crazy that they survived sort of this cancel culture, you know, all these little movements that have taken place.

Play from 0:45:31 8:88:88 0:45:31 They're still standing. It's 'cause it's sa it's it's perfect satire in most instances. Like it's it's so it's so correct and it's so fast and it hap mean, like it happens within five days of the event. And then it's like okay. It doesn't it's not lingering, it's like they get it out. But yeah, I mean we've we've spent a lot of time on the taste thing here, but I think it's probably a topic that's on everyone's mind. We hear about it all the time and uh I can't I hope people found that valuable because I think that is uh obviously we both feel very strongly that that's a big piece that we need to be thinking about collectively and individually as applies to whatever the hell we're doing.

0:45:55Figma updates and custom tools

Play from 0:46:08 8:88:88 0:46:08 Um, Rory, uh a couple more things I know we want to hit on here. You want to shift gears over to to Figma a bit, and then we can kind of get into a couple other areas. I also want to hit mid-journey. You know, we've got a couple of little updates there. We can provide you with through office hours. Also another little interesting thing with Adobe. So yeah, we'll try to cram this in here. So Figma, I thought had like if anyone's a Figma user, not a Figma user, anyone graphic design or doing anything, you know, remotely in the in the realm product designer, things like that in Figma, they released a bunch of good stuff at at Config last week.

Play from 0:46:46 8:88:88 0:46:46 I'm not just saying that because I was there, but it was something typically it's one of the only conferences like I really watch every year 'cause it's directly applicable. I'm in Figma every single day, no matter what. And it it felt probably the last two years like there was More so like not necessarily like the product releases were for the core user. you know, maybe to get more users or things like that. But this one felt like, all right, like design nerds, here you go.

Play from 0:47:13 8:88:88 0:47:13 Like have some fun. So and they added some interesting interesting like let's call it I don't want to call them interfaces, but it's just like ways to interact with the tool, which I think is great because n honestly, like it killed a lot of what I do in Photoshop now. Um you know, lot of what I do in Photoshop. You can build I think one of the coolest things they updated was you can build custom tools. So like you can talk to the Figma agent or build plugins, which typically, you know, you had to code.

Play from 0:47:41 8:88:88 0:47:41 Now you can just d do them right on canvas. Like I wanna do this. You know, can you create a plugin for, you know, for this and then just like pop it up at any time, whenever you want to. I think that's legit and awesome. And like that's a way to process things. I I don't wanna go off I don't wanna go off into a different direction here. Um, but even with that, Rory, can you I mean, can't you just see this where other companies start to layer in the ability to build customs tools right in their own product for their for their ni niche audience?

Play from 0:48:17 8:88:88 0:48:17 Like I'm just thinking about like, you know, a company I used to work for live event production software. Like it's a very niche thing. You're talking about like people that work the shows, they set up the stages, they do the audio, the video, right? They source the event, the people that are working the event. But like even in little spaces like that, cr like the ability for somebody that doesn't now really have to be that savvy, just kind of know the technology a bit, build custom tools for them, which again is coming from several layers down now, right?

Play from 0:48:48 8:88:88 0:48:48 You're going from the LLM provider to the company to the user, right? Like some people take the route right that they go around it and they don't even need the company to do it. They'll build their own tool. Um but anyway anyway, I n that's a dangerous thing to bring up. I just I wanted to say that like while you were talking about, but I don't think we should go off in that direct I would I would rather hear more about Figma specifically. So go forth.

Play from 0:49:13 8:88:88 0:49:13 I I mean look, like it's it's cool. Like I think it's a great I think it's sort of just like a great way to sort of entertain your audience or just like give them a little bit of something. Like if you know, you can go here now and if you go into excuse my my messy my messy, you know, workspace here. But you know, if you were to look at tools, right, you can turn just like ideas into plugins. I can be like, you know, trying I'll show some of the like example ones, right?

Play from 0:49:42 8:88:88 0:49:42 Like you have A bento grid builder. Like I love this thing. This is just a great tool. You know, it's basically you want to build a you want to build a bento grid or you know collage if anyone's not familiar with that. Just like now I can go, all right, I want to have it at, you know, 1920 by 1080. I want to have, you know, eight columns or seven columns, and I want to have six and maybe three. Whatever. Why is this not working here? Corner radius, yeah.

Play from 0:50:08 8:88:88 0:50:08 I can do the gap, I can change the colors, but regardless, I just hit generate and Bang, well I had I had something selected which wasn't wasn't great. Let's just do this again. There. So it just like created a collage, right? Like which is just even just to format this takes a little bit of time. Right now, these are all like specific frames and I can either just highlight, you know, these images and tell the agent to go like drop them in there, format them correctly.

Play from 0:50:34 8:88:88 0:50:34 Like all like these little things are super nice, especially if you're doing day-to-day stuff. So like this one to me was Like I love this. And you also have like all of like everyone's stuff that they're building in here. And like a lot of the community tools are coming up. So there's a lot of different things to check out within tools. The agent thing I thought was is pretty good. Like I've been I've been playing with it and you can build things like custom shaders.

Play from 0:51:00 8:88:88 0:51:00 And like that to me is legit. Like if anyone if anyone hasn't played with a shader before, there's a lot of different ways to think about it and use it. I'm using it at very basic levels, like things I used to use Photoshop for. Um, you can basically build camera raw in here if you wanted to. Like there's no nothing stopping you from doing that. and everything's custom. So like I did build a is this the one? Built a where the heck is this?

Play from 0:51:26 8:88:88 0:51:26 Built a matrix shader, right? Where I can control sort of the look and feel of like an image and just like overlay sort of like the matrix look on top of it, where you know I can control a lot of different pieces of it. Where the effect I can go and, you know, really play with a lot of different things. You know, if I need to, I can, you know, bring it up, I can bring it back down, I can change, I can, you know, get the f the wave frequency to make it a little bit more wiggly.

Play from 0:51:54 8:88:88 0:51:54 I can change like this the the streams of the of the channels, I can change the the text size, right? Like and make it a little bit bigger, I can change between hex and binary here. But you see it's all like just taking this image or this one. And then just modifying it. Like that one, fun. The other one I did was again, talking about the old vintage aesthetics thing. Was like I was doing this this thing with uh a samurai in the Nissan poster.

Play from 0:52:23 8:88:88 0:52:23 And then I built like a shader to give it like sort of like all the bad things that you probably were pissed off about about V CR cameras. So like the like all these extra all these extra things like a here might be a better picture, like all right. So Min and Min and I from from San Francisco and then I ran it on here and added all like the compression artifacts, the inner interlacing, the pixelation, right?

0:52:39Shaders, motion, and Weavy

Play from 0:52:51 8:88:88 0:52:51 Like the the the little bar here, if I pulled this open, again I'm giving it all these parameters that I want to be able to to change and then I can, you know, I can change a lot of stuff here. We can change the you know where the tracking bar is or that's 'cause I'm not selecting anything. Regardless, you know, it it's cool, like I can create these all basically these little custom tools that I want to. This one was fun. Like I would say these are more for fun than like function.

Play from 0:53:17 8:88:88 0:53:17 Right? I'm just trying to see what I can do with it and how far I can push it before I get into you know, some of the other stuff that people have been doing is is really unique. you know, a lot of designers, if you're not, you on it like this is something, uh, you know, using Figma Motion, which is another product that they added. and there's a lot of good stuff that people are doing with it. So like This one, for example, is use using with a shader and Figma motion. Like you can create some really awesome motion graphics and create some really good things if you're building websites or doing you know, anything product design focused because people are coming up with really cool things that you can do in real time now.

Play from 0:53:54 8:88:88 0:53:54 But that's just some of the Figma stuff, right? The Figma agent also you can just it can work on canvas, build frames for you, do things like that. I would say the way that Weavy is going to be integrated is cool as hell. So If you're familiar with building workflows in Weavy, now you can import that as a tool. Like if I wanted to do, you know, if if I wanted to build a workflow that takes an input image and does X. Like I can build that in Weavy, and then you can use it as a tool here so that whatever the output is, whenever it runs through your full process, it'll just hit go.

Play from 0:54:27 8:88:88 0:54:27 Right. And then it'll just pop up here and generate here. So there's there's some interesting things. And the best way to, I think, describe it, there's a good deep dive on how wevey is gonna be integrated into the Figma sort of ecosystem, which I thought was really cool. They're gonna have a Figma a Figma node. So you're gonna be able to take any frame you want and bring it into Weavy as a reference and it'll be linked. So like whatever you do in the Weavy node will also be linked back to the canvas.

Play from 0:54:56 8:88:88 0:54:56 So there's some good stuff here. I think let me just skip to the end. Maybe this is the wherever the part is I'm trying to find it. Um but this video from Ron and Gal over at the Weavy team, they they explained it all and they showed it on live demo. But you know, basically you can do sort of like batch generation. You can do multiple updates all at once.

Play from 0:55:22 8:88:88 0:55:22 You can have, you know, this working basically have Weavy in Canvas and within frames and generating how you like and generating sort of how you want to go. Once this gets released to everyone, I think it's still in dev. But you know, we'll definitely do a deep dive on it because I think it's gonna be sick. Just if anyone's working with Figma, that's gonna be a fun one for you, especially if you're doing anything in marketing or or you know asset creation like that.

Play from 0:55:48 8:88:88 0:55:48 Just cool stuff. Yeah. It's it's just like Figma g Figma got they were like, all right, here, you know, designers who want to design creative things, just go d do whatever you want. Basically, you now have you now have a lot more functionality to do that. So, you know, there's there's some cool stuff. There also the code to canvas thing is really cool. I won't get into that too much. That's that's for like, you know, heavy sort of niche here, but it's I just like directionally what they did.

0:56:01Retention beats acquisition

Play from 0:56:17 8:88:88 0:56:17 I don't think a lot of people were doing it. And this is another hot take I have, right? Everyone's so goddamn focused on acquisition that no one's thinking about retention at all. Like everything is New feature, we need to get new s subscribers. New this, new that, sign up today, fifty percent off, whatever, blah, blah, blah, blah. No one's like, how do I keep all these people? Right? 'Cause how many times have you signed up for a tool and then been like a month later, like, ah I'm done with this, right?

Play from 0:56:43 8:88:88 0:56:43 So Do do you think that in some regards, well, I well, definitely I would say the majority are it's just an oversight. But I think in in some regard, do you think people making those decisions think that that's in some ways a losing battle? And I'm not saying that's right, but in the sense that People are gonna change, like technology's moving, you new product could pop up tomorrow.

Play from 0:57:09 8:88:88 0:57:09 Like there's this inevitable churn that takes place regardless, but does that does that become does that become even more like is there more velocity now because of AI being introduced in that sense? And again, I'm not saying that that's the approach I would take. In fact, I think what you said is really undervalued. What are the what are the things that you could be leveraging AI for right now that Is sticky, and I don't think it necessarily has to be this shiny new feature.

Play from 0:57:40 8:88:88 0:57:40 Yeah, that's that's exactly it. in that space, you know, um, that's that's pretty interesting. granted, a lot of these companies are new and it's all a fundraising game and it's all a way to, you know, you have to show the investors you're getting new people and like I understand that. But there's a lot of legacy companies that are implementing these products that aren't keeping people the same way. So like Figma to me is kind of doing what we just talked about.

Play from 0:58:06 8:88:88 0:58:06 I'm coming up with this I you know, take on the fly here, this one now specifically, that Like what we just said is like how how creative can we let people be and how unique of stuff can they make? Like they're allowing that now. Like now there's the tools there and they're giving it to like the hardcore users who wanna go do that stuff. So like to me, you know, there's certain things like Adobe, don't get me wrong. There's a lot of stuff I don't use as much as I used to.

Play from 0:58:31 8:88:88 0:58:31 Like I don't use Illustrator, like I don't use I don't use what's it called as much as I used to. InDesign. Like just don't use it as much. And again, they've done nothing to really keep me other than giving me generative expand that one time and generative fill. Um, you know, I I felt more of it was like has been it hasn't been like tailored towards like the core Adobe user, if that makes sense. Like I don't feel like anything has been really like, we need to there's been a few things, obviously, don't get me wrong, they have like a hundred products.

Play from 0:59:03 8:88:88 0:59:03 So I'm guessing there's some people that love some of the things that they've released. But I just keep seeing people not Not feeding their cores, going back to brand building. This seems to come back somehow full circle. But I felt like the core was fulfilled in the in the Figma release. I feel like a lot of the core people and the core users got like a lot more stuff rather than like here's this big, you know. And that's the thing, is like people don't see that. I saw the stock price dropped during it.

Play from 0:59:29 8:88:88 0:59:29 And I'm like, everyone here from like, I don't know, 40 countries around the world, 20,000 people, power users, big organization. Everyone here is amped. Right. It's like Yeah. Yeah. It's weird. telling you that. This is not financial advice. Um, but stocks seems severely undervalued right now. I mean, severely.

Play from 0:59:54 8:88:88 0:59:54 I mean, it's like I I I didn't look at it in the last few days, but I mean it's like eighteen dollars a share. Yeah. It I was just really surprised. But regardless, I think they're doing a good job of like I think they're doing a lot of what Midjourney's been doing. Right? It's like building around community, keeping it like with that as the focus, giving the core like diehards more things to play with. Let them be creative. Don't over control or over engineer like what they can do.

Play from 1:00:21 8:88:88 1:00:21 Just like sort of let the creativity run wild and then like celebrate it. So I think uh think there's a nice little I think so too. Yeah. Nice, nice little segue there, brother. That was smooth. Buttery. so I I so much so that we could segue that in either direction. I think there are two last things we want to talk about. I I think let's start with Adobe just because I think it's just a a very quick thing.

Play from 1:00:49 8:88:88 1:00:49 but you know, they announced something man, maybe just yeah, when was it? Two days ago? I think it was this week. Um But they are launching uh Firefly Foundry. and essentially what that means is to enable enterprise custom AI model development. Now, if you recall, a couple weeks ago, months ago, whatever, we talked about Pinterest specifically developing its own model in-house.

1:00:59Adobe Firefly Foundry

Play from 1:01:18 8:88:88 1:01:18 So I the I I I didn't read to the depths of this, and again, because we're not going to go super deep into this, but this is a nice little anecdote. But They're going to be securing enterprise clients for custom AI models. and again, that like this is like one of those things where like this affects me and you down the stream a little bit.

Play from 1:01:46 8:88:88 1:01:46 You know, we're thinking about securing a big enterprise client, and we're gonna be doing um, I don't know, brand image work for them. Um, you know, these these teams now don't necessarily need that middle person, the outside person, because you would think that a bigger company like Adobe could supply not only the model, but the education on the model and exactly tailor it to all those needs. Um I just this is a interest very interesting thing and something to keep an eye on.

Play from 1:02:17 8:88:88 1:02:17 And then uh also today it was announced, of course I lost that on my screen. Um Let's do this really quick just so we can kind of get a visual up here. But they just inked Disney to the first uh deal on that. And um that definitely was supposed to be the first deal for sure. who is so against AI they seem pretty uh seem pretty interested as of as of recent.

1:02:25Disney enters custom AI models

Play from 1:02:47 8:88:88 1:02:47 Mmm. Huh. Here it is right here. Adobe and Walt Disney announced a partnership that uses Firefly Foundry to build custom AI image models trained on Disney IP. System can turn sketches into concept. Yeah, blah, blah, blah. And even convert 2D concepts into 3D attraction prototypes. So this is this is the piece, right? Like this is definitely one of the definitely one of the clearest examples of that.

Play from 1:03:14 8:88:88 1:03:14 happening at an enterprise level beyond what we talked about with Pinterest. So this particular product s uh service, if you will, being provided. This seems really hard to me. I'm just if I'm being blunt and honest about it, like Not on this don't do that on this podcast. Don't be blunt or honest on this podcast. being blunt about this, this just seems like a ton of work for how fast the space moves, and then all the maintenance that's gonna come with it, and all the scrutiny that's gonna come with it from the Disney contingent and like how sacred that IP is.

1:03:34The custom model problem

Play from 1:03:48 8:88:88 1:03:48 So, like, yeah, like this sounds like a wonderful idea in theory. I don't know how they have the money, time, or exp expediency to train models when that's not their core competency. Like, I don't under I like I don't they they haven't perfected their own. I I I don't think that they're even ha like completely satisfied with where they're at with their own. So Does anyone in here in the comment section, here's two things.

Play from 1:04:17 8:88:88 1:04:17 If in the comment section, if you use Firefly and that's your pre like your choice, drop it in there. Tell us why. Cause I I've been waiting for an answer on that one from someone that's like Firefly is the best and this is why. I think everyone just I think people are only using it because they have to. Um, and that's just my own personal opinion. I've used it, it's just not my choice, right? Like I and I don't have to use it because it's not I'm not on enterprise.

Play from 1:04:42 8:88:88 1:04:42 But the other thing is. Has anyone ever experienced again, drop that comment here. Has anyone worked with, experienced a brand that has a custom trained model for their brand and that thing is not a pain in the ass or is like proven valuable or doesn't need constant maintenance? Right? Like I I'm looking for an example of it. Yeah. Like w when do these models get updated? Um, you know, I'm so so is Adobe aggregating that through Nana Banana and these GPT like because it Flux probably.

Play from 1:05:16 8:88:88 1:05:16 I mean, like, that's the only one you could probably train at the current moment to w have like an aesthetic look that's that's sufficient enough. Um I d you know, maybe LTX, maybe you know, for video stuff, maybe it's it's not making sense to me in terms of like the investment of time, resources, money to get there. And then it's like, okay, well, this is outdated now because there's a much better there's a much better model. And like your stuff looks like the AI of Two months ago, which everyone can tell then.

Play from 1:05:46 8:88:88 1:05:46 You know, so it's and then things change. And then you do a rebranding and then you have to redo the whole system. Like, you know, especially if you have multiple products, you have different design systems for different products. Like, I don't I you know, different IP for Disney, how many every character is gonna have something there? It doesn't to me it there's like so many intricacies. Yeah. that use case versus other use cases that would be ideal for them. I mean, Disney's has all these images.

Play from 1:06:12 8:88:88 1:06:12 What about somebody that doesn't have a visual identity that's really solid built off decades of work? Entirely different approach. I mean, i I mean, it's possible, right? Like, I mean, obviously, like these are things that like you and I have solved for and other people listening to this have solved for, but like that's an entirely different thing too. And then You know, you're going to need a whole department and workforce dedicated to these specific types of engagements that are trained in real time.

Play from 1:06:43 8:88:88 1:06:43 Truck good luck. And if you're up to date at that level. you what, I can't I can't say much more about that. I actually can't say much more about this. So before and the first comment on this one is from Blacklight and it's just very, very, very him. But I I do you know, look, I think this is like a good marriage from like a user standpoint. I think a lot of people who use Topaz probably use Adobe.

Play from 1:07:08 8:88:88 1:07:08 Like this makes sense to me. This isn't like a yeah. Like I I feel like this one is just total sense. Rory, let's let's pivot. Let's go to let's wrap this up with uh some mid-journey chat. Let's um let's dive in. Um couple things, right? Like I I think we covered this in the previous episode, but just to like reiterate, the preview feature is available as a parameter right now.

1:07:09Midjourney preview mode

Play from 1:07:34 8:88:88 1:07:34 Dash dash preview behind any prompt, you're gonna get um images that are coming from what's currently in the model for V. 8.2, their upcoming model. So this is a new thing. They haven't done this before. Kind of like this approach. Really interesting. You can get feedback in real time. You haven't formally released it. So you don't have all this pressure. You you know, even even if it's not what people want or expect, you're taking those insights and that sentiment and reconfiguring it and making it better.

Play from 1:08:07 8:88:88 1:08:07 So it's the building in public piece that I think is just a really smooth move by them. And then um, you know, just a couple other things here to note. You know, like in draft are you only running preview now? 'Cause I'm like only running preview at this point. I just I like it so much. Like I like the the aesthetic. Yeah. I I mean I think so. and then I would say, um well I guess like the the eight point two.

1:08:18Midjourney V8.2 texture and skin detail

Play from 1:08:34 8:88:88 1:08:34 Um just like really briefly, what what are your observations in terms of what you're seeing differently between those images? Let's talk about that for a second. Color, as always, detail. I'm seeing a lot more texture. I don't know. It feels a little bit it just f it just feels a little better. Like look at the skin. Like, do you know what I mean? Like look the the depth in in the skin and like there's still this the same funky Midjourney stuff that it does.

Play from 1:09:02 8:88:88 1:09:02 But that like, you know, like her teeth, right? Like she has two giant beaver chompers, but like the skin, incredible. Like the That's the bet might be some of the best skin I've ever seen on AI, right there. Like seriously. Yeah. Like look at that. Even like the the coloration of the skin from like the eyes under the bags, like we can if we go in and look at that stuff, right?

Play from 1:09:28 8:88:88 1:09:28 Look at hold on right. preview. I think I can. Yeah. So let's jump out of here. Yeah, I haven't run much actually. at that. That's that's gorgeous to me. Just doesn't look like the the standard AI face that you see on on everywhere else. Are you prompting for freckles there, by the way? Mm no. I'm wondering if the Freckle thing is coming back. Remember remember like V five?

Play from 1:09:54 8:88:88 1:09:54 Yeah. Just as bad, but it definitely shows up without you asking for it. We love the freckles. But I mean look. It's great. Very fat I like those glasses. Those are fire. swear I had a sixth grade teacher that looked exactly like this. And I went to Catholic school, baby, uniforms and everything. Um Yeah, for sure.

Play from 1:10:19 8:88:88 1:10:19 No, sh no, none none of them were. Dude, I mean they now makes a lot of sense as to why there's a lot of nuns with guns and you know little trauma. way through halfway well, halfway through high school. So I mean, um, church every week, uniforms. You had two options for shirts. You know what I mean? It's either maroon or it's white, you know?

Play from 1:10:45 8:88:88 1:10:45 Um stubble on that face. Better shave that. Not that I could throw stuff. okay. There was I remember that used to be a thing. come till I think college. They used to give you like a bic one blade disposable razor. I that I I remember my friends having to do that, just ha hack jobs. It was so funny. There was what else you got here on this?

Play from 1:11:10 8:88:88 1:11:10 No, I was just gonna say, like, I guess in terms of what they're saying, right? Better overall image quality. I have noticed like the like the uniqueness of the posing, both in some of like the images that, you know, I just showed you, which is not a lot, but also just seeing other people generating things in preview, um, seem to be a little bit more unique and distinct in that sense. So maybe we're also getting rid of, you know, some of those like dead, lifeless, you know, if you don't Ca you if you don't prompt text prompt for the pose, you might not, you know, you're not gonna get nothing.

Play from 1:11:43 8:88:88 1:11:43 Um so maybe that's sort of going away too. Also of the uh here, let me just pull this up just into what to to verify what I was saying on the on the detail texture. And like some of this stuff might not be anatomically correct, but like this one to me got me with like a click into it and then go in. Yeah. I was like, there is oh, what the hell? There's a lot going on texture wise.

Play from 1:12:09 8:88:88 1:12:09 Like of course, I wanted to play with the texture. Um, 'cause I just love it. But I thought some of these have been like really impressive from a texture standpoint. Like this one, you know, even just like all the little flame let's see if we can open this in a new no no, open it with a new tab. Like the level of detail in the flames, right? Like, there's a lot. A lot of texture, a lot of depth, you know, even the stitching here.

Play from 1:12:36 8:88:88 1:12:36 Like th there's a lot of stuff going on in this in this one image. But I was I was running a bunch of stuff, of course. You know, like this stuff was making me happy. You know, it's so weird. I just I love it, how weird it is. You know, like just the oversized mouths, like the r it's like I lo I love doing that stuff. but again I felt like it was There was some really unique sort of outputs that I was getting that I wasn't you know, this one definitely a lot different of a run from from V eight point one.

Play from 1:13:13 8:88:88 1:13:13 a lot of the stuff was just rerunning of what I did in V eight point one to check the difference. But, you know, again, just noticing a lot of things on the texture and the detail side of things, you know, where like There's just so much, even micro refractions, like these little threadings and textures down here, like even the braids, like you can see it all. It's all there. The tongue, the the taste buds, you know, the gum discoloration, like and stuff like that.

Play from 1:13:40 8:88:88 1:13:40 And this is this is what I'm talking about. Like everyone, you know, we're we're focusing too. Zoom in on the eyebrow where the paint's like overlaying it. Like let's It's kinda looks like his eyebrows are painted on or just like doesn't look like it's translating there. Doesn't but Some of the other stuff, the details of the nose are translating here. just be, you know, there's also I think some inconsistencies with with V8 in general.

Play from 1:14:09 8:88:88 1:14:09 Um, and I'm not necessarily complaining about that. This is just an observation that you'll, you know, image to image, like if you're out of a set of four, you might get a couple that just look a little bit more dialed in than the others, you know, so in terms of like the tackiness, the sharpness to it, the detail. Like again, there's a really random sort of style and aesthetic and just like the the full on texture here.

Play from 1:14:37 8:88:88 1:14:37 And I I think that's kind of what we've all maybe, maybe not at least, maybe not all of us, but like me. I just you see the difference in the texture between this and something else, and you're like I want all this. Like I want this with with the level of with sort of the level of control Yeah, just a little bit more control. And then I'm gonna be sad. Cause like this is so much fun to play with.

Play from 1:15:02 8:88:88 1:15:02 Like just this level of detail for me specifically, right? Like I love playing with this. And I'll hit the button a million times. But that's just you know, I don't know if anyone else is is feeling that way. Like I just I like being able to play with this and not have to worry about you know not have to worry about writing every single little detail for something that extravagant.

Play from 1:15:27 8:88:88 1:15:27 or that, you know, over the top. which is nice. I miss it. I miss I miss being able to just rip. But that's that's been mine. Color, texture, like prompting to me feels pretty similar. I'm also just bashing mood boards together. So you know you never know what's affecting what. Yeah. ways to do it now that don't require you just starting from scratch. Um, you know, draft mode, you can do um S ref random.

Play from 1:15:57 8:88:88 1:15:57 not 245, 24. Um, so just that. I thought that's an interesting thing if you want to explore that way. Also, you can combine S ref random with mood board codes for a little bit of a different spin on it. Going back to V2, currently in testing, nearing release. Um, nothing crazy here in terms of the improvements other than maybe just aesthetic, but they did mention they're already doing V9 training runs. New data set work is underway.

1:16:13Midjourney V9 training and web redesign

Play from 1:16:24 8:88:88 1:16:24 other big thing that we're gonna notice sooner rather than later is probably this web interface update. They're working on mobile as well, but the website redesign, they got a big task there. There's a lot of things you can do in Mid-Journey. And from a user experience point, we've even even we knowing all of them, forget about them. So I can't imagine people that come in here time to, you know, from time to time.

1:16:43Midjourney editing roadmap

Play from 1:16:51 8:88:88 1:16:51 And then, you know, like when you get into all those parameters and permutation, like there's just a lot, the settings, the mood boards, the profiles, like there's just a lot everywhere. It's a big, that's a big, um, that's a big project. And then I think obviously number one on my mind is the the edit model, which no real update on timeline here, but says it's the highest development priority.

Play from 1:17:19 8:88:88 1:17:19 Omni reference style editing first, more advanced regional editing, so in painting and out painting, and full editing workflow afterwards. Huh. So omni reference style editing okay. More advanced regional okay, good. In painting, out painting. Full editing workflow afterwards what's a full editing workflow. That's Omni reference would be good that's first.

Play from 1:17:45 8:88:88 1:17:45 Just wanna use it. Just wanna use it a little bit. capabilities, changing subjects, objects, environments. You also gotta think I I don't know if this makes it to the beginning, but you know, again, like you think about what something like is it Quinn? I think that does this and you know, it's it's in magnific, but it's like I I may have even showed this on the podcast, but it's like you can just do the variations where you select what camera options you want in terms of the angles and perspectives.

Play from 1:18:15 8:88:88 1:18:15 It just takes that existing image and bakes it out for you. Like you just get nine instantly in a three by three grid or something like that. Like I wonder if that's part of it. Um or you know, their own version of that. But I don't know, really exciting, ambiguous here with the full editing, but ambiguous enough to get me excited and hopefully not let down. But Edit Models the Game Changer. Edit model's the game changer. We've been saying that.

Play from 1:18:40 8:88:88 1:18:40 So Well, I just wanna play I just wanna play with some of these characters a little bit. Like I just wanna like maybe change that one character's facial style. You know, like the one where the with the the crazy, you know, pink and green face that we just saw. Like maybe instead of like the screaming I want like a straight face. And it's like things like that. You know, I just wanna do simple I don't have to go over the top, would be cool. I'm not expecting it. Rory, when we were painting out things like Like that, like maybe mouth.

Play from 1:19:09 8:88:88 1:19:09 Maybe we didn't like the mouth. Maybe we didn't like the earring, you know, um, or the hat or the hairstyle or something like that, you know. And then you just had to like click generate, regenerate. Yeah, there weren't there weren't any tools that could do that at the time when they launched that. And now we're here. Uh crazy. Um, but I think that's go ahead. don't know if they updated this or they put an update on it. Do you notice now that when you when you upscale, you can do it in V8?

Play from 1:19:37 8:88:88 1:19:37 Just like a little thing. You know, like I didn't have to like erase one little dot and then bring it back down into V7 to then upscale it again. Like you can just do it straight from editor now. Which I was uh was not I just noticed it the other day. And I was like, alright. It's not V7 anymore. But little little Observation. have you been on the explore page in a while, by the way?

Play from 1:20:04 8:88:88 1:20:04 Uh I don't know. Why? It's like I don't know if it's just me. Just like it hasn't been wowing me lately. Just on it the other day and because I feel like there's so much cool like there you go. Like that's a you know, that's more what I'm talking about. Maybe it's my personalization stuff. I like that. I like the guy next to it with the highlight, you know, with the die-cut highlight.

Play from 1:20:29 8:88:88 1:20:29 I like the Alright, yours looks better than mine. What the hell? You got better taste than me, dude. but maybe you didn't sort through the um these are top month, you know. this isn't my personal one? Oh, I was in 4U, that's why. Okay. No wonder. Wasn't even looking at top wasn't even looking at top month. Just go in there every once in a while nowadays, because I I'm I tired of seeing the same stuff.

Play from 1:20:56 8:88:88 1:20:56 yeah, I I I don't yeah, I I don't actually even use the four you. Fuck, man, I probably should be. what for this is what I forget about some of this stuff sometimes 'cause you get so d tied up doing everything else that it's like I used to go on the f the f uh you know this explore page all the time and just like look for stuff. was like a rite of passage. Yeah. It was just like I just wanna see what c cr where crazy people's brains were going.

Play from 1:21:23 8:88:88 1:21:23 And now, you know, I don't I don't have that as much. I should probably do it more you know, like you know how much value we had in those Yeah. So deep. Just a reminder, just a reminder about the secret search. Secret search. For for everything. Images, styles. So click into something, click this. You're going to get close examples. They're usually higher quality than if you were to search for just a keyword in general.

1:21:34Secret search tip

Play from 1:21:51 8:88:88 1:21:51 Just a little tip. Little tip. Same with styles. Like I think you can. I I haven't been on here in a long time, but I think you can do the same thing where. Yep. So let's just say this, and it's going to give me similar like you know, what it thinks is similar color palette, style, codes. So yeah. can use image image as a search, which is like nice.

Play from 1:22:17 8:88:88 1:22:17 Thanks. Needed that. So it was a says beta. Did it by mistake the other day, didn't even know it was there. But do this is I'm like I just did I just did that draft mode, but I did R forty. So I got four what's forty times twenty-four? Don't make us do math here. We already can't say a lot of words. ninety six.

Play from 1:22:43 8:88:88 1:22:43 N nine hundred and sixty? Fruit. Is that right? hundred I just got nine hundred and sixty styles. Boom. What? that's insane. Someone by the way you'd appreciate this. Someone in the comments the other day, I'm sorry if you're listening and I forget who said it 'cause it was it but it r it reminded me s someone mentioned the nail in the foot. So they've been around for a while. Yeah. okay. Let's I gotta tell you this, because we both had our problems with with with feed and and and uh toes on this podcast.

1:23:03Broken toes and podcast lore

Play from 1:23:14 8:88:88 1:23:14 You on the nail, you know, I don't know if you're a call, it's been about a little over a year now, but literally got a new dining room table. First week I had it, smashed, just just walking around my own house. You know, just walking around my own house, nothing cool, nothing sports. smoked my foot on this chair, which I you know, I I do this all the time. I'm I'm I'm not clumsy, but I'm like spatially I like I I guess I like just I don't know just look past what I'm doing.

Play from 1:23:42 8:88:88 1:23:42 Yeah, autopilot. There we go. Smashed toe, broke toe, had to wear a boot for a month, you know, that whole thing. Literally getting ready to go on this trip, this vacation, uh this family vacation. And I'm going down the steps and I take a step and like Almost fall and I bend like my foot backwards to like try to like catch myself. This is the same foot by the way. And I was like almost positive.

Play from 1:24:10 8:88:88 1:24:10 I broke another toe in in the process, same foot. Just walking around my house, you know, just doing my own thing. And it still hurts. Like it's still this has been a couple weeks now, it still hurts. But I am not going back to the hospital for that stuff. Um It it's ridiculous what they what they charging just for like little x-rays. oh And all they did was give me a boot and a little splint and just say, yo, wear this for a little bit.

Play from 1:24:36 8:88:88 1:24:36 It's gonna yeah. So I already know the whole thing. I'm not going through it, but like I was I instantly thought of you, I was like, dude, we are we're dude, our feet, our feet are tried and true over here. I had to like think about it for a second, then I was like, yeah. And back then I couldn't get the foot stepping on the nail on on the image generation side. Now I probably can. Might have to might have to bring that back.

Play from 1:25:03 8:88:88 1:25:03 but the that I just I just found that one to be very funny. We also had shout out to few config uh a few config people who said they were regular listeners. Love the love the show. So another good one. Makes us feel good when you see when guys see us and tell us that. It's like the one thing I care about. You know, it's like my LinkedIn post, whatever. You tell us we like the podcast. You guys are best friend. Yeah. That's and it's out to my uh dental hygienist before we go.

1:25:14Listener shoutouts

Play from 1:25:33 8:88:88 1:25:33 Uh, I told her I was, I was like, hey, look, she's like, You're gonna, you put these in. I'm like, well, I gotta do a podcast. Like, I'm just probably gonna take these out. Like, I'm not gonna put them in until I'm done. She goes, What's the name of your podcast? So I gave her the info. She's like, I'll probably listen to it. I'm like, okay. Um, and then she was like, Uh, I'm gonna be watching to see if you're wearing them on the podcast. And I said, Okay. So In and you know what?

Play from 1:25:59 8:88:88 1:25:59 The Lisp wasn't really the I'm actually pleasantly surprised, man. So Not that bad. Why does it sound like it on your end? Do you feel like you're wisping? just I was expecting worse because I've I feel like I've known people that have done this and it was very obvious. can have spit all over your screen here when you when you're done with the day talking. I that was that that'll happen. or homogeneous or anything like that on this podcast.

Play from 1:26:26 8:88:88 1:26:26 Operationalization. The word once now you have to have one word flub to be officially part of this podcast, so and he that applies even if you're a guest. Didn't Tyler didn't Tyler have one of those on this? Yeah. Yes. Yeah, you had one. It was a immediate, instant success. He's now part of the family. We can we can officially you know, we can officially initiate him. But unbelievable. Unbelievable.

Play from 1:26:52 8:88:88 1:26:52 Hey, I think we're gonna have a guest next week. Just a little shout out. need to double confirm that. Um, I was telling you about that. I don't wanna reveal who it is just because it's not hundred percent concrete. I wanna lock that in. but I'm thinking that's what we'll do next week. Should be a good episode. Um, Rory, we kinda already did the subscriber shout out, but I mean We gotta do it again. You know, just to just to wrap it up.

1:27:13Subscribe, hype, tell a mechanic

Play from 1:27:17 8:88:88 1:27:17 If you're here, if you've listened to all of this, if you made it through all of that, just tell somebody. Do something, like it, like it, subscribe to you don't have to subscribe either, just comment. Comment's actually better, probably. like, subscribe, tell a friend, but and also hype. Yes, hype also. That button works. Um, the other thing is, you know, now that we've gone through dental. Hygienus. What about like a dermatologist?

Play from 1:27:43 8:88:88 1:27:43 Have we gone there before yet? Maybe it's summer. Yeah. Your local pharmacy worker who's gonna you're buying sunscreen and whatever else from. Um, that's a good one. You know, maybe we've had to do Amazon delivery driver in the US here. There's we did? Okay. Damn. That's that's pretty good. Did we no yes from the that's right.

Play from 1:28:08 8:88:88 1:28:08 From from the Amazons. There's a lot of There's a lot of just shot up after that. That was wild. Yeah. Great times, man. Or your mechanic. There you go, there's a new one. And I don't think we've done mechanic yet. But tell your friends, tell them, tell whatever. And then you know, we'll be back here doing this next couple weeks until, you know, further notice. All right?

Play from 1:28:34 8:88:88 1:28:34 No, we are not. Right? So let's go. All right. Well, uh, thanks for joining us, guys. we will see you guys in the next one. See you next week. See