Ep. 1: We Accidentally Became Midjourney Experts (Here's How It Happened)

0:00:00Why We're Nerding Out Over AI Image Gen

Play from 0:00:00 8:88:88 0:00:00 So, we're live. We are live. Rory Flynn, Drew Brucker here starting something new. And I think this is a This is long overdue. Drew and I have been nerding out over this stuff in the background for God knows how long. And all we do is talk about this. And you know, it's sounds kind of sounds kind of pathetic at the same time. But really, you know, again, when you look at the landscape of podcast and why the hell we want to do something like this, everything is just AI news.

Play from 0:00:26 8:88:88 0:00:26 Like, okay, you know, this new tool came out. Oh my God, new announcement here. Great. Awesome. But you know, there's no place for anyone to really hang out and just nerd out over a tool like Midjourney. You know, we talk about it enough. We post about it enough. So, let's just talk about it. I mean, who the hell cares at this point? You know, there's obviously a ton of updates and news that come out every day for these different tools and you know, different theories and all these cool different avenues and directions to you know, have conversations around. But again, a lot of it's trimmed down to these really short sound bites and these really quick podcasts. So, you know what? We're going to try to go longer form on this stuff.

Play from 0:01:02 8:88:88 0:01:02 Just wanted to give everyone an intro here as to why the hell we're doing this and what we think we can do with it. And you know, This is going to be cathartic for us. You know, like we need a therapy session with Midjourney. And you know, I think at the end of the day, Rory and I realized that there aren't any Midjourney podcasts out there, right? And I think that's that is the primary reason we're here is because like no one is really having these conversations at a group level outside of Midjourney's office hours events. And you know, mid you know, Rory and I really spend a lot of time talking on the phone about some of this stuff. We've obviously done some of these live sessions on platforms like YouTube and LinkedIn. We love the engagement, the interaction there with the community. So, I think this is you know, really going to be helpful not

Play from 0:01:48 8:88:88 0:01:48 only for us, but for the community at large and really just kind of dive into things like misconceptions, best way to approach things, use cases for AI image generation, all those things and just take you know a really I guess genuine and authentic approach about it, you know, and really just kind of let our guard down and just give you an unfiltered POV on some of this stuff. Can I interject for a second? I also Absolutely. just want to let everyone know we have no idea what the hell we're doing. So, you know, this is fun. You're coming along for the ride. No clue what the hell we're doing. We're just rolling with it. If it works, awesome. If it doesn't, that's cool, too. But, you know what? We need an element, so we're going to talk about some stuff. But, I Absolutely.

Play from 0:02:30 8:88:88 0:02:30 You know, I think I think you know first before we get into this, this is going to be a little bit more of like an intro episode. We'll just roll, see where it goes from there. But, you know, I wanted to ask Drew again like going back to that first moment like that spark, that like fire in the belly of what the hell is this thing that I just jumped into? What is this tool? How does this thing work and what can I do with it? Like when was when was that moment? How did that work? Yeah, this is going to be interesting cuz I know I've heard your story a little bit, too, and I think we started, you know, around similar times. But, for me, I want to say it was maybe November or December of '22. Like I'm pretty sure it was V4. You know, it was definitely before V5 because I remember that inflection point. But, you know, just becoming a dad in really wanting to still be involved in

0:03:00From Dad Life to Digital Artist: Drew's AI Awakening

Play from 0:03:15 8:88:88 0:03:15 photography in some way, you know, and then just having some of that time and logistical, you know, challenges come up, right? Like taking pictures wasn't as big of a part of my life as I would have hoped it would continue to be. And when I found Midjourney, I think it was I don't remember the moment or where I found out about it, but I remember seeing it maybe two or three times to the point where I was like, "Okay, this seems like it's worth jumping into. Let me play around." Got in there, jumped in, was immediately amazed by some of the results even back then, although the consistency, you know, was a little bit more sketch, you know, at that time.

Play from 0:03:49 8:88:88 0:03:49 We'll call it sketch. But, you know, I I it was really like the inflection point for me was the jump from V4 to V5 and seeing that quality really just changed the landscape of, "Hey, I'm just doing this for fun." And maybe this has like some utility in business to, "Hey, I could use this at work." And at that time, right, fully employed at a tech company leading a marketing team thinking about things like branding and image generation.

Play from 0:04:20 8:88:88 0:04:20 And you know, just perception, you know, by a market. And just thinking through some of the challenges that we have as marketers of, "Hey, do we have like brand images that really speak to our audience? You know, are they the skin color of our audience? Are they the age? Are they wearing what our audience wears? Are they hanging out where our audience hangs out? You know, do they have our colors involved, right?" Like we we all know how challenging that is to find stock photography in that that regard. And then it was It's terrible, right? And it was the full-scale opposite end of that as like a leader managing a budget thinking, "I can't spend 5 to 10,000 dollars to go hire a photographer, maybe fly them out somewhere, reserve a location, hire models that look like our people, reserve time." We don't have time for

Play from 0:05:06 8:88:88 0:05:06 that startup world, right? So, I just immediately saw that opportunity and we had a I'll never forget this, we had a customer event that was coming up and we were building a landing page for it, getting people to sign up and reserve a spot, save their seat. And that whole process of building the landing page, setting up this live event that was coming up was done basically through AI, I would say for 80 to 90% of it. You know, I was using things like large language models at that time even for some of the copy and the structure of how I wanted to approach the landing page. And then we needed things like an an image to represent this event or to supplement the theme of the event. And then we needed all these images that we were going to have at the live event with slides and swag and you know, all those

Play from 0:05:52 8:88:88 0:05:52 things that come with it. And I just thought Midjourney, I think could solve this problem. Let me just like take a crack at it. And And to me it wasn't even like I wouldn't even put in that much like strategic thought into it. It was really just like one of those organic moments where it came to life. You know, I saw people's faces within the organization like, "Wow, I didn't even know this was possible." And then I was at that customer event where you know, the slides are up on the screen and it looks and feels like us. It's got our colors, it's got our people, it's got our, you know, the message alongside it, you know, really thoughtful copy that associates with the theme that would have taken our team hours to come up with. And it was all, you know, really done with with AI power uh and and enhanced by, you know, just human creativity on top of that. And so, for

Play from 0:06:38 8:88:88 0:06:38 me, that was the that was definitely the inflection point of seeing that come to life and seeing those images come up on the screens and on swag. And then from there, um I would just really double down on it, right? It was it was I was hooked at that point, right? Because again, the quality was so good, the consistency got better. And once you put one of those kind of ideas out there and you have that proof of concept, you begin to unlock all these other different ways and use cases that it potentially has.

Play from 0:07:06 8:88:88 0:07:06 So, that's my story. I was going to say, man, there's a there's First off, before we get into anything else, just a moment of silence for V4. God, that was like the best. I love V4 so much. Like just even going back to thinking I went back the other day. Yeah. Yeah, pour one out. Went back the other day to uh to check my archive on some of the V4 stuff. And I was like, "Man, my creativity levels were so much better back then when I did not have to create content." Like it was so much different when I wasn't trying to show how to do it versus like when it was just pure Yeah.

0:07:30Rory's Late-Night Discovery That Changed Everything

Play from 0:07:38 8:88:88 0:07:38 Right? It was like being a kid. Like oh my god, whatever I want. This is so random. It really was. Dude, that was know, that is such an underrated explanation of it. Like cuz I I just like my remembering is me sitting in my basement at night, you know, just kind of the lights really moody and I'm just sitting there coming up with like just random images of things that you know, I I'd never use probably, but you know, you're just seeing those things come up for the first time and that was just one of those technological moments where you're just like, "Wow, this is just now capable and it's only going to get better from here." You know, and that when you think about that like from a meta level, you're just like, "Holy Like this is this is special."

Play from 0:08:20 8:88:88 0:08:20 Also, the dopamine hits back then, no joke. When when it was harder to get what you wanted and like you put in all these generations and it was slower and you were on Discord and it was just like one of those, "All right, I'm going to try to get like an alien levitating in the middle of a desert, but I want it to look photorealistic and I want it to have, you know, vintage 1960s like inspired fashion." And it's like, "What the hell?" When you got it, you were like, "Damn, I am I know.

Play from 0:08:49 8:88:88 0:08:49 Nailed it. Nailed it like inject it right into my veins, you know, like because it was the inconsistency at that time was almost like a good thing because it mattered more when you got the right thing. And you know, like you might run several rerolls and then you get the one, right? And it's just like, "Damn, got it. Got it." But that was how we got I think that's how you get good at, you know, one of the one of the main things I whenever I preach, whenever I preach on, you know, on podcast, webinars, whatever, I'm just like, "If you're not using the tools, get into the tools early when they suck." Or, you know, granted, Midjourney you never sucked. It was just like when they're at their base level and they're not fully built out.

Play from 0:09:29 8:88:88 0:09:29 Cuz like when you go with the every iteration, you just know how it functions, it's so much easier to use. You can connect the dots of why this matters, why the change matters, why they got rid of this, why they added that. I mean prompting in prompting in V4, like I got to the point where I was like I I need to get what I want. I need to get it quicker. So then we start building processes and operations and things like that. And then before you know what I'm utilizing this very prompt structure where it's like subject colon this, environment colon this. Like trying to really direct the tool to do exactly what I wanted. And then V5 comes around it's totally different. It's like you have to use bigger, you know, more generic keywords and then like that will go and take your image in a crazy direction. Then V6 comes back around it's super granular and that works again.

Play from 0:10:14 8:88:88 0:10:14 So it's like we had that baseline, right? Yeah. We did. crazy how this stuff like is cyclical in nature too. Like I loved I loved V4 for the creativity because it was so creative. Like it wasn't I feel like V5 like they focused on quality and it was awesome. You know, the quality got better but you got less like You got less like ridiculousness. The weirdness. Yeah, that's I I I feel like that was that was almost part of why they rolled maybe maybe why they rolled weirdness out at that time, you know, because it was just like you're absolutely right. You would just get a little bit more variety and weirdness. Maybe you know, like at that time. And so anyway, before we go too far down that, I want to know, you know, your background of how you got started on it. I I mean,

Play from 0:11:00 8:88:88 0:11:00 I know it but it's super interesting I think for for anybody listening because, you know, Rory and I have some alignment in the sense that Rory's a sales guy, I'm a marketing guy but we've been in totally different spaces but we kind of understand some of the same things. And you've got completely different use cases from me. So I would love to love for you to share that with with anybody listening too. Yeah, totally. I mean look, this is I think everyone who's obsessed with Midjourney has some level of like art in their background whether that be in film production, whether that be in photography, whether that be in graphic design. I was a graphic designer, um, you know, back in the day.

Play from 0:11:39 8:88:88 0:11:39 Admittedly, a very mediocre one. Um, basically cuz I could never get my vision to come across the way that I wanted to cuz I wasn't good enough with the tools. I was never traditionally trained, but I bootstrapped my way to make it work and then, you know, I've gotten into sales, things like that, but marketing mostly in, you know, the digital and e-commerce digital marketing like e-commerce space, talking like email marketing, paid ads, things like that. But, that being said, it was like one night I was, you know, doing I think what anybody does, nice little late-night Twitter doom scroll, and I started seeing like these images that were like, what the hell is that? And it was, uh, I think it was like the the Pope either in like a Balenciaga jacket or Peter Griffin as like a 1980s, uh, you know, sitcom star.

0:12:00The Wild Ride of Midjourney's Glow-Up

Play from 0:12:20 8:88:88 0:12:20 I'm like, come on. I'm like, who's making this? Where is this happening? And then it was like, Midjourney. And I was like, what the hell is this? Then I went on the site and it was like, you have to get to Discord. You have to connect with the Discord. I'm like, oh my god. What? I'd only seen Discord in like the NFT and like crypto crypto community. I was so far behind there. I mean, I had it, but I never used it. And then, you know, before you know it, I jump on one like one night and I'm just like, okay, let's make a dog collar brand. And it was like, bang, it spit out this image that looked actually like a dog. And I was like, come on. You know, let me Now, you know, I'm posting on LinkedIn at the time and I'm just doing like, screw it. Like, you know, nothing's working at the moment. Let's just post this Let's just post this whole like, you know, brand idea that I came up with on, uh, you know, on Midjourney.

Play from 0:13:06 8:88:88 0:13:06 viral, and I wasn't expecting Really? Right away? Right away. And people were like, what the Now, there's one one person I will attribute this to was, uh, Luke, one of the one of the guys at Affiliate World. Um, definitely, I saw I think I saw an ad from him too, also doing the same thing like building a brand. And I was like, you know what? I can do this also. Let me do this and see if it works and make some content around it cuz it's just fun, you know, it was just fun content at the time.

Play from 0:13:33 8:88:88 0:13:33 And then, you know, viral. And I'm like, uh-oh. And before you know it, it is like, yeah, used to getting maybe like a 20, 30, 40 likes on stuff, and this one got like, you know, 800 and had like 500,000 impressions, and I'm just getting roasted in the comment section. Like, absolutely smashed, you know, like just this is trash. Oh my god, dude. What Oh, yeah, right.

Play from 0:13:58 8:88:88 0:13:58 Yeah, yeah. And I was like, guys, this was fun. I'm not trying to build a brand with the goddamn, you know, Midjourney tool. It was just fun. Too many Too many people think it's got to be, you know, too far It's got to be, you know, exactly perfect or you mean it, you know, like there's no middle ground for you to use AI sometimes. People are either all in or they're all out, right? So, I mean, like, I see that a lot with with people that don't seem to really be playing with the tools, and that's funny.

Play from 0:14:25 8:88:88 0:14:25 You know, like, similar experience on the LinkedIn standpoint, too, right? Like, I I had been posting for a while, but mostly marketing stuff. I was I was growing my following, and I think it was like a little bit of a goal for a while, like, but mostly just, you know, build credibility as a marketer, to get on some podcast, do some speaking engagements, which I I did. But, right, when I changed that content, I had a similar thing where I just I don't know, I just shared like just random collection of images. I was like, you know, what, like, part of being a photographer, I miss this part, you know, I'm able to do this, this, and this now with with AI tech. Like, just kind of check out these images, like, this is what this this tech is capable of right now. You know, and I think a lot of people were surprised by that. And so, um it didn't go viral, but like I I got enough

Play from 0:15:12 8:88:88 0:15:12 indication from I think those first two or three posts where it was like, okay, totally switch my approach on this. Plus, it's fun, right? So fun. I mean, let's get real. The first thing that I was using it for was cuz I Look, being quite honest with everyone, I suck at copywriting, right? Like my my whole thing is just to get get you get you to my carousel, hopefully you'll read it, and then we go from is This guy is joking right now.

Play from 0:15:37 8:88:88 0:15:37 I'm a bad I I I hate it when I write it, and I hate it when I read it. But, the thing was I had these carousel covers, right? And the reason that I wanted to do things on LinkedIn where it was like I was just scrolling LinkedIn, everything was so stale. It was like stale. Here's a Here's an image of me at like a tech conference. Like, yeah, it's like selfie this, selfie that. Read my blog. Yeah, read my blog. here. Yeah. I try to find the craziest stock images that I could before Midjourney, which was like, you know, here's like a this crazy like robot thing that like doesn't make any sense with what I'm talking about, but it's just like another way for you to stop your scroll because LinkedIn just looks like very stale. So, like for me, then when I started getting that, I was like, oh, let me just blast covers out with Midjourney and make them look so

Play from 0:16:23 8:88:88 0:16:23 ridiculous that people on LinkedIn are like, I haven't seen this today. And then it started to be like, where are you getting these covers? And I'm like, I'm making them. And they're like, what program? I'm like, You know, it was like it was like, oh, why don't you Could you Could you Could you show us how to make that? And I was like, sure, I'll make a carousel on it viral. I was like, come on. Is this really happening? So, then I just started doing like a weekly one where it was like, here's what I'm And I I remember I used to put it for like I think I used to title it, you know, Midjourney for be- ginners like me. And it was just like I I disclaim everything. Like, I just started using this. I'm telling you exactly what I'm doing, what mistakes I'm making, where I suck. And just like it it just started going from there before it was like a full pivot to just like let's just talk about this full time. Um but yeah, I mean, back again, like I think about

Play from 0:17:10 8:88:88 0:17:10 even 16 months ago, 18 months ago maybe, where LinkedIn was in terms of like the content and it was so bland. The only people that were writing on there were copywriters or people talking about how to how to grow your LinkedIn on LinkedIn. It was like Yeah, there's that there's that point in time, right? Where you've got so many followers that it no longer matters what got you there. You just know how to grow on LinkedIn now and that's your product. Yeah. I mean, it's just a you know, so funny. But there's so many use cases now. I mean, like you look back at what we used to do it for. It was like novel.

Play from 0:17:44 8:88:88 0:17:44 It some you know, I hope that maybe some other people feel this way, too. Every once in a while you start using it professionally. It becomes a little bit it has definitely like if I'm being candid with everyone, it has a little bit of like a I don't say like a negative feeling about it sometimes, but it sometimes you just feel like you're just pushing stuff out because you have to. It's not you're not not you have like there still has to be room for those creative like I just want to have fun for myself sessions. Yes. We just go in there and sleep on an idea. It's like screw it. I don't care if anyone sees this. I had fun with that. Or they're like troll my friends, you know, like I'll go in there you know, make avatars of them doing stupid stuff, face swap them and like bang.

0:18:00How Midjourney is Breaking All the Rules

Play from 0:18:19 8:88:88 0:18:19 Send it out like it's a meme. So, you know, there's there's fun stuff to do on there, but I do think probably, you know, again, when I'm telling people how to get started on this stuff and how to like get utilizing it, it's mostly going to start for fun. Like you can't just if you go into it just like I need asset for X product or X initiative or campaign, whatever. It just it's it feels different. It doesn't feel fun. But if you do it for fun for yourself and like, you know, you can nerd out with someone like Drew, then then then it's like you can have endless endless like creative like endless creative power. Endless fun like basically nostalgia to me. Feel like a kid again.

Play from 0:19:00 8:88:88 0:19:00 Okay, so I think that's a great unlock and reframe because like for me like I'm a very curious person. I've played with a a of tools. You have to know it knowing you. But when it when you start for fun versus I need to, I think that makes a big difference, right? We were just talking about this with Figma, right? Like you picked up Figma a while back. I know I've known for a while I should be using Figma. I just haven't, you know, and I I think it's the same thing, right? It's like I have to, I need to, but like I don't really have that spark of that urge and maybe I need to treat it more like it's fun. But I I think that's a great point, right? And I think um also when it comes to you know, AI image generation,

Play from 0:19:47 8:88:88 0:19:47 it's so it's it's less talked about by 10x versus like a large language model, right? But it's equally as important, I think, in a lot of ways, right? Especially when you get into the creative space, anything with branding, marketing, sales enablement, right? And and I always find myself educating people on the use cases at large, but then also the use cases that exist right now that are really you shouldn't even be thinking twice about, right? Because Obviously you've got some people that are concerned about you know, rightfully so, like maybe some of the copyright things or we don't know what we don't know yet with some of this stuff and the regulations. If you're a bigger company, maybe that's maybe that's completely fine, right? But there

Play from 0:20:34 8:88:88 0:20:34 are also all of these use cases that exist right now, whether we're talking about just using it for your content on social, whether you're talking about using it for small things like icons or illustrations for your brand, right? Like this doesn't have to be photorealism stuff like the stock photography. This could be anything, right? Mood boards, storyboards, which you talk a ton about, right? So just like generating ideas and using visuals as the aid to get you there, right? And the way that I always think about it on top of that, too, is with AI in the fold, you know, there's going to be more content created now and in the future than ever before, right? So, how do you actually stand out? And it's not just about words, right? Like, yes, you know, you can be creative or you can utilize,

Play from 0:21:19 8:88:88 0:21:19 you know, ChatGPT or Claude and elevate your creativity with copywriting and all that stuff. That's great. But, you also need to have visuals, right? Because visuals are going to stop the scroll faster than text. People skim, and visuals are digested faster. And you can be very bold and, you know, really be about whatever your brand stands for in immediate way with something that's very unique and custom using a tool like this. And at the bare minimum, right, you just need to understand that. And I just, you know, I I think the democratization of it could be interesting, you know, like to see does this get to a point where you know, a lot of people are going to have their hands in it in some way or another like Canva is now on marketing teams, or does it stay a little bit more specialized?

Play from 0:22:05 8:88:88 0:22:05 You know, like like a Photoshop crowd, right? So, I you know, it's just be interesting to see how that plays out over the next couple of years. Good point on the I don't think Midjourney gets talked about or any of the image generators for that standpoint. It gets talked about in the same way as like, you know, an an LLM would or a ChatGPT would. It's just like it doesn't talk back to you. I think that's what there's like not a there's not as much of like a human or like weirdness factor to it where like you can have a conversation with ChatGPT as if it's like your best friend or your grandma or a nuclear physicist, whatever. Like you can make it work like that. But, you know, I've always like had this like meta question. Like it like does it feel like AI, you know, like when I'm prompting Midjourney like I say it's AI, but like does it feel like AI? Cuz it's not like communicating with me at all. You know what I mean?

Play from 0:22:51 8:88:88 0:22:51 So, yes. time, it's basically like right, it's like an execution of like what's in my brain. Like I'm just trying to get it out, it's producing it. Versus like ChatGPT, I'm like interacting with it, which is different. So, I don't know if it's going to get to that point, too. It might It might get to that point where you're looking at an image and being like, "Okay, like, you know, dididididi." Instead of like just prompt and generate, it's like prompt, generate, similar to what it is like in DALL-E, where you can you can like talk to it and be like, "Oh, can I change like the background color to red?"

Play from 0:23:20 8:88:88 0:23:20 Whatever. Things that, you know, it's like where can these tools go to make it more interactive? Yeah. Cuz that's going to be useful for people. Um, you know, cuz right now we're like I still consider it like hacking, right? Like a lot of this stuff feels like it's hacking, like we're breaking down prompt structures and building out different formulas and whatnot. And it's like just to get like exactly what we want instead of it just being conversational, which, you know, who knows if we're going to be able to even like voice prompt at some point.

Play from 0:23:48 8:88:88 0:23:48 Like who knows? Think about that. I I I love that idea, too, right? Because, um, you know, you just think about how you use this. I'm curious, I don't know that I've ever asked you this, but I find myself, too, like when I'm out of Fast Hours or if I don't want to use them, like I'll I'll even if I'm on the go, I'll be typing in prompts on my phone, and it's not the easiest thing to do. I will say that like Midjourney's done a pretty reasonable job with it, considering that they're not really paying it that much attention.

Play from 0:24:15 8:88:88 0:24:15 Yeah. You know, but like it's still hard to do and type all those things and think about all the different, you know, parameters and you know, things that you have to get exactly right, otherwise an error pops up, right? But imagine just being on the go, you know, similar to like hour or like a pie, where you can just have a conversation and say, "Hey, I want to run this exact same thing, except I want the background red," like you said, "or I want to, you know, hit a different camera angle, or want to do this with the same character." That could be especially, you know, powerful. If you're talking about, "Hey, I want to use the same character, or I want to use style reference X."

Play from 0:24:50 8:88:88 0:24:50 You know, at this image weight or this style weight. Like that would be pretty wild. That would I think it's going to get there. I mean, it makes a lot of sense, right? I don't I haven't heard many people talking about it, but it was like, you know, ChatGPT for me I was like I never used the voice until I used the voice and now it's like it's all I use, right? Showing it to my wife the other day in the car, she's like, "How do I How do I just type this thing in?" I'm like, "No, just push the plus sign and talk or the mic sign and talk to it." And she was like, "Wait, you can do that?" I was like, "It's cool, right?"

0:25:00Unleashing Your Inner Child: The Joy of AI Creativity

Play from 0:25:17 8:88:88 0:25:17 She's like, "Keep talking." I'm like, "Keep adding more detail. Like don't stop." But that's what I'm thinking about in terms of, you know, obviously we have like a token limit that we play with right now. I'm in the journey. Right? Like it's one size. That'll probably increase as we go up, right? Because every model all they're doing is just adding more data, so it's just getting bigger and bigger and bigger the brain. Like the voice voice option, some people might be like, "That's dumb." I'll be like, "Yeah, I mean, it probably is dumb, but also I think it could help especially for usability on the go like that." Or I have an idea I can't I can't prompt it cuz I'm walking my freaking dog, you know, and I'm like, "I want to do this cuz I want to get it out of my head right now before I forget that and it gets buried in the 2 million other things that I'm thinking about today, right? Like bang, voice, enter it, let it run. And then I love that I, you know, let's let's reference, you know,

Play from 0:26:03 8:88:88 0:26:03 this style reference code or whatever cuz they're The one thing I do miss about Discord is like the preferred option set that was uh I never used that. I I mean, I just didn't I just didn't use that. That's not to say that it wasn't valuable at all. I just never used it. Yeah. It was great with like tune when you had 5.2 when you had like this the the style codes, right? Like whenever you have like a million different codes and I was like, "All right, if I just want to use like preferred option set to name these so I know it so I don't have to like remember the code or dig back cuz like going through your archive on a site and then going back to Discord at that time was like a bit So, it's like, you know, I I'd do a code and then like I just name it like, I don't know, like Tulum or something cuz that was what the original image I generated.

Play from 0:26:45 8:88:88 0:26:45 Did the code keep like the entire prompt or did it was it like the parameters for the prompt or like what could it be? Okay. So, it's the parameters so it it would add the style code and then if I had anything else from like a you know you can keep it just as the style code or you can add you know aspect ratio stylized chaos weird whatever. see see I would have used that. I I would have used that had I probably known what I know now you know or use it the way that I use it. Yeah.

Play from 0:27:10 8:88:88 0:27:10 I mean we've been using this site for a long time now. When did this site come out now? Like November December? Probably. I mean has to be because you know I remember waiting before we were you know talking about if we're going to drop do like courses and tutorials on this stuff and like well if you do that we have to do both like you have to do the website and the Discord because it's No because we knew it was coming. Yeah. The only thing this is it like here's here's my hot button take for for Midjourney because I granted love Midjourney don't I think they are undefeated in terms of product releases and how they do it. The only thing that's take that's to have like kind of like that Sora esque approach has been the website where it's like oh it'll be you know available to the public soon and soon is now 6 months but

Play from 0:27:56 8:88:88 0:27:56 it's like if you generate 100 images on Discord you can get in. I just don't understand what the point of that is unless there's a partnership with Discord and they want to keep people there which I understand cuz they like help them but yeah or they you know I think they have the largest community base on Discord in general so I don't think they just want to abandon them. I think there's yeah there's been some conversation. There has to be right? Like we were joking about that before it was like man I hope whoever's in charge of user base at Discord has already told their boss that hey this is coming because people are going to leave in flocks and yeah I think I think that's right. Um Because this is what thing right? Like these new tools and this is a this is beyond Midjourney everyone. This is just Rory ranting cuz he doesn't like this and I you know unfortunately it's going to get replicated a million times. You

Play from 0:28:42 8:88:88 0:28:42 know this Sora this Sora model or this OpenAI model where it's like let's build all this hype. Let's release Let's, you know, build like this epic release of this product. We'll give it to a bunch of beta testers who will then release all their stuff at the same time, who are probably within the organization, so we can build their personal brands as everything goes viral with this absolutely revolutionary tech. We can build our personal brand or our organizational like social or our organizational organic channel, and that becomes like a convertible channel. And then, you know, we'll just tell you it's going to be available soon, and then soon turns into 6 months. Now, like I've seen this happen with a few other companies. You're seeing Runway potentially do this right now. I hope they don't make us wait 6 months. But, you know, Midjourney typically, the way

Play from 0:29:27 8:88:88 0:29:27 they've released products, I've I love it. It's just middle of the night, cloak of darkness, no PR, no big push, just like, let me send out one tweet, uh new personalization features available, everyone have fun. And then they let the community take it and run with it and do their own help their their own thing. So, like to me, you know, they they go, they listen, they look at, you know, you have the ability to make feedback in or provide feedback on the website, and you can talk on Discord, you can suggest ideas, the community votes on them, and typically whatever is the highest, you know, has the highest votes on it, they go and do it. So, it's like it's a whole new way to build a company and to market a company. And yeah, I'm just like I hope this Sora stupid freaking model of marketing doesn't continue cuz it's really annoying. It just builds everyone up to a fever pitch and like

Play from 0:30:12 8:88:88 0:30:12 then just nothing. It's like it's Christmas Eve, but you can't have your gifts for another 9 months. Hey honey, I got your I got your birthday present. I know it's only it's 2 months away, but I know you could use it right now. Yeah. Yeah, I mean like So, like who, you know, I I am going to be the biggest hypocrite of all time. I'm going to say, screw Sora when it comes out, I'm just not going to use it, but I know I'm going to use it right away as soon as it comes out, but still I just want to hate them right now because it's just like I don't blame you.

Play from 0:30:43 8:88:88 0:30:43 Come on, you know, you see Toys "R" Us commercial the other day, right? That thing comes out. That thing goes viral, of course, you know, and because of that Toys "R" Us has like basically this unfair I'm not going to say they have an unfair advantage, but they do have an advantage because they are making waves. They are impression value is super high because they're using the tools and people can't. So, how do they, you know, like what is the what is the implications of that? And that's why I think Midjourney is great. I don't think there's any real beta testers that get to release stuff ahead of time or get to test new features. Um you know, we all get to kind of do that. And then from there, I mean really the only thing we were allowed to beta test was the website. And that's for people who had used it. Now, granted that's not like revolutionary tech. That's a website.

Play from 0:31:24 8:88:88 0:31:24 That's a little bit different. So, maybe I'm talking out of both sides of my mouth. But just like they do to me they do things that's a very product and consumer-centric way. Where it's like we focus on the product. We want it to be good for our customers and we're going to give them access to do whatever the hell they want. Marketing-wise, who gives a Like if the product's good, it'll play for itself it'll pay for itself. I think it's I think it's almost like a pipe dream for the type of company that you'd really kind of like hope to work for if if it's a product that you really like because right? Let's let's just compare OpenAI, you know, to to Midjourney and they're not really competitors in a lot of ways.

0:32:00Battling the Haters: Our AI War Stories

Play from 0:32:04 8:88:88 0:32:04 But you know, just in terms of like the approach. You just mentioned Sora. They've got their VC-funded. They had you know, they got to please stakeholders. All these other people, right? And then you've got Midjourney who's not VC-funded. They haven't taken outside money that that ties them down or doesn't focus, you know, specifically on the users which keeps them very authentic, altruistic. We're going to do things that not only do we think make sense, but you've told us make sense, right? So, you've got that two-way validation and these discussions and it's a master It's been like a real master class in a very unsuspecting way in terms of like just community-driven approach. It's not even like they've done anything, you know, extraordinary in some regard.

Play from 0:32:49 8:88:88 0:32:49 Like it's just like it's just been almost unintentionally intentionally great. Like I don't I have a hard time explaining it, but like, you know, in Midjourney's office hours day David who got, you know, who's the the founder, you know, gets on there and he's just like talking about how he's trying to get more and more people using the website. There's still a lot of people using Discord, which I think is really weird and I'm just like, I love the website. I don't know why more people are But he he was focused on this idea of like, "How can we bring some of this magic that's hap that that that was there on Discord over to the site?" And I don't know how to solve that. You know, and there was sort of like a little bit of magic there. And again, I don't know if that's because it was the golden age of Midjourney, all these things are changing, and everybody's adopting it

Play from 0:33:34 8:88:88 0:33:34 and figuring it out. Um, or what? But I I do think that was sort of like a very interesting component of the conversation. Uh and just to to kind of run around with this like too, I just it's been a very, I guess, uh refreshing approach because it really is focused on you. You know, it's not like Midjourney doesn't seem fake in any way. I mean, they don't they're not even active on social. You know what I mean? Like They follow one person or maybe zero.

Play from 0:34:02 8:88:88 0:34:02 It's such an unconventional and effective approach for them. This is what I'm say like, to me, I always felt like they didn't I don't know if their intention was to not market at all or just let the community do it because we go out there, we get so hyped about what they do because we produce like they produce it on our behalf essentially. Oh, you know what? You we we release style codes. Style codes are awesome, but like I want to blend two style codes, you know, but you can't do that on the site. It's all about it. So, I'll hack around it and use Sref for two different images or five different images to create this like total combination of style codes.

Play from 0:34:39 8:88:88 0:34:39 They start seeing that stuff. They're like, "Okay, we'll build a function that you can add to and then you can weight them." It's like, "Thank you. You just did exactly what I wanted to do so I don't have to hack around it." I mean, how many times was it, "Okay, we're trying to build consistent styles and aesthetics. Let's find a text prompt way to hack around it." Great. Sref. We can't get consistent characters. We're doing like character sheets and all this other stuff to try and like hack around it. Bang. They come out with character reference. It's just like they get it. They listen. They see it and then they produce something for us and then they don't have to market it cuz we're so damn excited. We go and post about it.

Play from 0:35:10 8:88:88 0:35:10 We're like, "Look what you can do." So, you know, it's it's a really I don't remember if I can think of a product that did this that was this product-focused with a community and then, you know, from there just like doesn't have to do any PR, doesn't have to release a commercial, doesn't they The only like marketing material they have is like their magazine and they do that only for subscribers. So, it's like not even doing it externally.

Play from 0:35:39 8:88:88 0:35:39 Um, it's, you know, I can't imagine what the value is for them. The the social play, I mean, yeah, I mean, yeah, I think I do think that's part of the magic, right? Because you've got all those those channels in Discord and it's I was just thinking about how do they take all those consumer insights and leverage them then, right? Because they've got this community. They've got to do some of that and that's that's a piece of I I think why they're still holding on to to Discord right now, right? Because they do have access to all these different channels with micro polls and announcements uh, prompt battles and, you know, alpha ideas and bugs and fixes, right? And they've started to move some of that over to the site, right? But but more of the social and ideation chat, you know, channels and things like that, those don't currently exist on the site. So, there's a big piece of that social component that's missing right now and

Play from 0:36:26 8:88:88 0:36:26 uh, I don't know how soon they fix it, but uh I I know it's on the radar, but I would imagine you're going to see Discord still for a while until they've really solved for that, because that is the magic. That is the sauce. Well, going back that's a really great point about the magic, right? Like that goes Let's Let's circle back, I don't know, 30 minutes ago is when we were talking about version four, where it's like there's I have a positive association with Discord because of those days, you know, like the same way we probably have a positive association with like AOL Instant Messenger, like AIM, back when we were, you know, growing up. It was like the tech wasn't great, but we had fun on it because it was new and it was like I can talk to my friends and send away messages with like, you know, emo quotes from bands in the early 2000s.

Play from 0:37:12 8:88:88 0:37:12 What What was your What was your MySpace song, man? God, you know, let's let's get a top angle top angle shot looking down, you know, like very one eye, maybe a shadow over here. Yeah. Probably some uh probably some God, I don't know, New Found Glory or something in the background. New Found Glory. You know, I mean Taking Back Sunday. TBS. Come on, baby. You know, I mean, come on, we Brand New.

Play from 0:37:37 8:88:88 0:37:37 The whole beef between Brand New and TBS, come on, man. We go deep. Yeah. Anyone here who has no idea what we're talking about, probably too young. There was a There was a phase. It was great. And it was It was short-lived, but we still listen to it. It wasn't a phase, Mom. Sorry. There's like it's like that association with like that time where it was so new and it was so different because it was so crazy, like Yeah, I think that's the That's the point is it's like there's the nostalgia effect, there's also this really um intangible but important time where because a concept is new, you you pallet the imperfections within it and you like that about it.

0:38:00The Mind-Blowing Future of AI-Powered Imagination

Play from 0:38:24 8:88:88 0:38:24 Yeah. You know what I mean? Um and and I like I'm going to make kind of an an association here, but like think about this. Like if you're a hip-hop fan, I still think like hip-hop and rap was the best '90s, early 2000s tops. Of course. But but most of those beats at the time, right? Like just for autotune and all those extra things. But like people are making beats on these little mixers that aren't even supposed to be for this, right? Like people are being creative with the tools that that go on to the future to really change the entire little, you know, group or community. And I think like even the imperfections in that process, right? Are just something that you can hold on to and it just feels more magical, you know, for for lack of a

Play from 0:39:10 8:88:88 0:39:10 better word, right? Because I I I think there's something to that nostalgia effect, too. And then you and I have both gone through this this journey of when we started and like how our lives kind of changed a lot, you know, because of that, right? Like we we both talked about like you were at an agency, I was leading a marketing team in tech, and both of our lives have changed a lot since then, right? Not only did you become a dad, uh which is change, but like also, right? Like people started like we we both understood how um appetizing this type of concept in in tech was and there weren't as many people talking about it and we filled that void. And in return, right? Like that only fueled our fire more because

Play from 0:39:56 8:88:88 0:39:56 we wanted to lay down that bridge and educate other people because we knew how important it was going to be. Yeah. Still we know how important it's going to be in the future, right? And so I think that's it's important um to consider that as well. And you know, I think it all comes from like again, because the initial like intro to this was so shocking and it was so visceral. When you could just take thoughts out of your head and get it down. Like when I used to draw, you know, I used to use a erase a lot of things and just like I'd end up doing it for hours. Granted, I loved it, but I could only do like one or two concepts cuz that's all my time would allow. But I'm also ADD, so you can, you know, probably tell from this conversation how many different places my brain goes. Now I can run 17 prompts at once. Holy crap. You know, like that

Play from 0:40:43 8:88:88 0:40:43 was and it was really just going from there and think you know anyone really saw it as as powerful in the beginning and it wasn't I don't think either of us were just like we're going to do this thing and become like, you know, like just talking about Midjourney all the time. We're just going to be like, you know, AI bros. It was, you know, I had to use it in the business. It was just a it was sink or swim at that point. We didn't have any other options and it just happened to be something that we could utilize and it wasn't, you know, from a you know, for anyone who doesn't know know know this and you know, just starting to listen. I used to this started with email marketing for me.

Play from 0:41:16 8:88:88 0:41:16 Like, you know, you get all those stupid emails everyone in your inbox. You go back to those promotional, you know, that promotion tab to maybe like never. Um, but you know, again for us it was like how do we we had to do 10 plus emails a month for 90 clients. It was 900 emails a month. We just didn't have creative. So, you know, we'd always using the same stuff over and over again and everything, you know, metrics falling, whatever. So, like how do we tell better stories on here? How do we make better visuals? And that was the one way is just plug it in. Can it do brand colors and, you know, salad dressing that we're trying to market?

Play from 0:41:47 8:88:88 0:41:47 Can it have, you know, the active ingredient avocado oil? Can we have a picture of avocado and oil in the brand colors and that's what the story is about. It worked and it was quick and it was easy and back then it was small format email-wise. You know, you get 90% of people that are opening on their phones. You know, you didn't have to have an upscaler. You know, 10 you know, 1000 1024 pic or pixels by 1024 pixels works. So, it just happened to be like perfectly slotted. And then it's like, wait. Where else can this thing work?

Play from 0:42:15 8:88:88 0:42:15 Then you start going and you realize it can help teams internally. It can help your whole company. But, you know, I think a lot of the use case like I keep coming back to it is that I think a lot of people are just probably getting onto this now cuz it's either like the company is telling them, their friends are telling them they got to do it. It's like getting more kind of mainstream sort of adoption in the workplace. But, it's like it comes back to having fun with it cuz if you don't If you don't want to like create things and you have to create things, to me that's the biggest difference.

Play from 0:42:45 8:88:88 0:42:45 Like the biggest dichotomy. You're going from side to side here. Like one Same thing Same with writing. Like Like with writing or even photography. Like I just think about I I you know, like I could have gone all in on photography if I I wanted to. Like I could have done more side hustle gigs to take photos for money. I did that a few times. And then then I realized like I want to take pictures of the things I want to take pictures of. I don't want to take pictures of somebody else's family like at a park. Like Even if it Even if it's for money, I don't want to spend hours You know, so like I I think you Yeah, it it's all of like Where does that line exist for you between fun and I think if it it it sort of organically makes its way into, you know, the picture then it's a little bit um

Play from 0:43:32 8:88:88 0:43:32 it's a little bit like less you know, there's less friction there. You know, versus just kind of embracing them that way. So, I think that's like a main you know, theme and underpin for this particular combo in general, I would say. Cuz I get it I get it every once in a while, right? Where I'm sure you probably get this, too. I start looking back at my archive and I'm like, this stuff looks so boring because, you know, I'm not saying my my content is boring.

Play from 0:43:58 8:88:88 0:43:58 It's just when I'm explaining it it has to be simple, right? Like it can't be it can't be what I want to do, which is multi-prompt, add 17 different S refs, you know, change you know, add an image prompt, switch the image weight, do all this other crazy stuff, dial up the chaos value, you know, vary use a, you know, very subtle, very strong. Like when I Like that process, impossible to explain on paper. Like I could probably do it in a video, but it's just too many variables to explain if everyone doesn't know it. So, you know, when I get to that point, when I look and I'm looking for an image and I'm like, "None of these things stand out." I'm like, "I got to go have some fun. I just have to put this I have to put the you know, the the content creation down first for a minute." And then I'll just go create what I want. And maybe it's going on the explore page. Maybe it's like I'll see

Play from 0:44:43 8:88:88 0:44:43 something on TV, turn on Ancient Aliens or something and be like, "Okay, I need to you know, let me create some Anunnaki stuff." And like really from there, you know? Like a Ooh, look what kind of Anunnaki tech or landscape or, you know, like ritualistic kind of like ceremony can I try to create? So, yeah, and then before you know it, that stuff ends up leading to, "Oh, now I figured out how to do X." That's, you know, that's originally how cuz I wanted to use Runway. Right? Like I want When Runway came out, I wanted to do Runway, but I wanted to do Runway well cuz I wanted to see if we could use it for business.

Play from 0:45:17 8:88:88 0:45:17 Right? I wanted to see if there's any use cases for it. Um I knew I could create I like the first thing I thought of with that wasn't I need to create full-fledged videos. I was like, "I can create now GIFs for emails." Like GIFs, like simple, right? Like I can create a video file, 4 seconds, loop it, GIF. Great. And again, customizable, right? Like there might not be a GIF that currently exists that would that would speak or be custom in that way, right? Whereas creating something on demand's again, another huge unlock. Yeah.

Play from 0:45:44 8:88:88 0:45:44 And it was just like, "Oh, but like I need things to be consistent." But Midjourney doesn't produce overly consistent. So, how do I like basically come up with a consistent structure to make things look exactly the same. Doesn't need to be image prompting. Doesn't need to be the text prompt. Doesn't need to be seed. Doesn't need to be whatever. So, it's like all these little things that end up having, you know, it's like all these little problems that you solve for basically other things half the time that end up being like translatable. So, it's you know, the thing is there is no I haven't really found a limitation except someone the other day. This is a good one.

Play from 0:46:19 8:88:88 0:46:19 Someone the other day asked me and I I apologize if I didn't get back to them because I saw it while I was like, you know, 3:00 in the morning doing my my night feeding with with [name] and like she's she's wailing and I'm like, you know, one arm one arm feeding her with a bottle the other arm like scrolling to try and like stay awake and someone asked me, "Can you can you actually generate an upside-down goldfish in Midjourney with like the light coming in from the top onto the belly?" And I was like, "Yeah, why not?"

Play from 0:46:47 8:88:88 0:46:47 I spent like I, you know, I put her to bed at like 3:30, 3:45. I probably spent like an hour and a half trying to figure that out. It was just not working. It's like image prompt, style reference, multi-prompting, you know, trying to get trying to like build images and then like it just get the construction down. Like Midjourney would not do it. Like this is the first time I found something that was really hard for it to do. Like it couldn't conceptualize the upside-down fish and like have the light coming in from the top. It was very hard.

Play from 0:47:15 8:88:88 0:47:15 always like a couple things, too, like based on the data that maybe like you couldn't do. But but I I just want to go back to one quick point cuz you made something very interesting. You're talking about how the creative process or having fun might actually affect, you know, just sort of how you move forward things. And I really think like for example, you just mentioned like the consistent how do I get more consistency? While there's not this direct and easy way to do it, you know, that's what people do is we try to figure out a loophole or a way around it. And I think in many ways maybe that's why prompt what's became a thing. Like trying to have a structured prompt, you know, um template or an idea of how you're going to format the prompts because you were looking for consistency with things like camera angles,

Play from 0:48:02 8:88:88 0:48:02 subjects, and and you know, that it would identify and you know, put in the proper perspective or use the proper colors, right? And and there was sort of some successes that you would see. So again, like that idea probably came out of us, not just not just you and me, but like people trying to get consistency in their approach of creating images, right? And and knowing what to expect. So like that that concept was made up by us creators as we're trying to manipulate the tool, I guess is my point.

Play from 0:48:35 8:88:88 0:48:35 And that's what I mean. I don't even know if we go back to like Midjourney, their documentation, like I don't even know if they had any documentation on like how to use the tool. It was basically like, here's the functions. Like figure it out. Because I don't know if they exactly how to like basically create consistency or create consistent patterns because I don't know if that's what they're focused on. They weren't focused on instructing. They were just focused on getting a product delivered and like delivering it to us consistently. So it was like all of us who were trying to actually get to that point of like we're obsessed, right? Like we're obsessed, we're trying to get this.

Play from 0:49:06 8:88:88 0:49:06 Um you know, and there was a thing for me was like, okay, like I need to have these structures cuz I need to do it for work. But then didn't realize that having a prompt structure is you can operationalize that. You know, that that can be shared across an organization. You can teach people how to use it that way. And it's very like conceptually it works. Um and again, like I hate using prompt structures because I feel like I'm you know, I'm lacking creativity, but at the same time, you know, when I need to get stuff out of works. So it's this whole this whole like evolution of it for us to get from like one point to the next. I feel like it always starts with fun. Like that's how I used to train our team on using it. Was like daily Slack challenges, right? Like this is we'd all get on there. Someone would pick a theme. That was it. Just one theme. Could be anything.

Play from 0:49:50 8:88:88 0:49:50 Love Love it. Didn't have to be whatever. It was just everyone submitted one image and that was it. Showed your prompt, thought process. That was it. It was a 20-minute exercise each Damn, I'm I'm jealous. I wasn't a part of that, man. I had no one to talk to for a long time. Like I mean, no one on my team cared about it, you know, like I I you know, not to take too much credit here, but like when AI dropped, you know, especially with LLMs, you know, as the team leader, I'm I'm trying to say, "Hey guys, like let's have fun with these tools, but mostly let's experiment because we know this is going to disrupt the workforce and I'd rather tell you to start now.

Play from 0:50:26 8:88:88 0:50:26 I'm already playing with it. I think you should play with it. I want you to block time off your calendar to play with it." So, like that part of it I could do, but with Midjourney, I'm extremely jealous of that because I didn't really have that uh anybody I could really like bounce things off at that time. So, lucky luckily we uh we we crossed paths at some point here. Um and I think When when that happened But it was like, "Oh, he's actually doing the same thing as me." Yes. Like someone else that I can talk to.

Play from 0:50:55 8:88:88 0:50:55 in a lot of ways like and I'll just say I think you you were exactly what I needed in in a way too because like I needed someone that saw things in a similar way and then to really like identify how somebody else viewed it, you know, to to sort of validate, "Hey, like here's how somebody else is thinking about it. This is kind of the way I'm thinking about it or I hadn't thought about that, right?" So, like so everybody can't you know, do these things in in a silo and so I think like that idea that we have somebody that um is working on some things, you know, like some pieces of it that are connected or similar is important to have, man. So, I'm just thankful we crossed paths and I'm and uh you know, ever ever since then, right? We've just been kind of doing these nerd out sessions. So.

Play from 0:51:39 8:88:88 0:51:39 Dude, it's awesome because again, look, let's talk about it, too. Shared trauma. Like there's also times where we're just getting roasted. Like I just remember often times getting There was days where it was like I put something up and I knew it was I knew it was going to be kind of controversial, but having someone else that's like all right, yeah, they're doing the same thing. You know, like I'm like, okay. All right, cool. It's not just me taking, you know, taking grenades in the trenches by myself. Someone else has felt this and I'll never forget it. It was six Actually, it might have been almost be a year from now a year ago July when I I made this spec ad for Nike using Runway and Midjourney.

Play from 0:52:17 8:88:88 0:52:17 Yeah, I remember that. I remember it. Yeah. I swear to God and I did everything with AI and I had, you know, the music made by AI and whatever. And it was just roast fest from everyone. And I guarantee I mean I guarantee like 80% of those people were nerding out over Sora when it came out. I was just like my my whole message was It's like this is where it's at right now. This is like That was a year ago, dude. And I remember that one. I remember that.

Play from 0:52:45 8:88:88 0:52:45 And it was just like No, but it like at that time I mean I I hadn't seen anybody like really manipulating the tool that well at that time. It was crazy. It was crazy. But like having said that, dude, I mean you had plenty of people, too, that were like, dude, this is this crazy. This wild. Like I mean But it But it yeah, it's it's important to have the haters, too. We welcome the haters every once in a while. It depends how much patience we got. I mean if if you're just like an AI critic in general, like Yeah.

Play from 0:53:12 8:88:88 0:53:12 I don't know if I have the time to really get opinion. It's boring. I got to stay away from that. You know, but but having said that, right? Like I think there's there's something to say for people that feel conflicted, you know, and have valid concerns, you know, relatively speaking in terms of like how far is this going to go? You know, I'm worried. I'm anxious. And I think like you don't have to be either ang you know, excited or scared and anxious. Like I think for a lot of us there are going to be great things that come out of this. There's probably going to be some bad things come out of it, too.

Play from 0:53:46 8:88:88 0:53:46 They're not ex- They're not mutually exclusive feelings, right? You can feel both ways. So. It's The thing is like again, with those with the recycled AI opinions, like I get it if you're just parroting it. It's like it's pointless. Like come up with a more nuanced approach to it because we've answered that question 600 times and we've battled that battle 600 times, you know? Everyone the That was like when I started to get pissed at the at the hooks on on every single platform, you know? Like AI is not going to take your job. Someone with AI will take your job. Who knows AI won't take your job. Whatever the hell that thing was. It was just like, all right, we get it. Like we've heard it 30,000 times. We get And then you still have the people that you still have the people too that were like, yeah, my my friend said it best, you know? AI is not going to take your job. Somebody using it. Yeah, it's like, no, no. Your friend didn't come up with

Play from 0:54:32 8:88:88 0:54:32 that. We've heard that like a thousand times already for at least a year, you know? So. It was like so so insane that that would that just took off and it was like the It was like the mantra for like 12 months. But, you know, at the same time, like the thing is this doesn't have to be for everyone and everyone doesn't have to use it. You don't have to use it. Not everyone had to use Photoshop when it came out. You could use other things. Like you didn't have to use a video camera when it came out. You could still take photographs. It's just like whatever the market demands is what the market demands. Unfortunately, that's a really un- you know, opinion that most people don't like. But, at the same time, you know, this is what happens and it's These tools are now available to us to actually go ahead and create whatever we want to. I think a lot of people also

Play from 0:55:17 8:88:88 0:55:17 get this misconception that everyone that uses these tools is just like new to their task or like new to their industry. Like people who using ChatGPT are new to copywriting, right? You know, there's probably a lot of copywriters that are great at using ChatGPT cuz they know exactly how to instruct it, right? Same thing with you being a photographer. You know exactly how to instruct a tool because you've taken thousands of pictures, you've thought about and calculated all these different things in your head to like I actually want to have back light using this type of focal length because that's XYZ going to make it look like this, right? So, there's there is a creative thought process. People think that you push a button and it comes out. It's like, "No."

Play from 0:55:58 8:88:88 0:55:58 That's not how it works. Please go on and try because most of the time I feel like that's coming from people who never tried to utilize the tools or haven't fully like understood people's thought processes to get to the end result because there is a creative process that goes into it. It's really not just man in a park, enter, bang, kill. Totally. Totally. You you got to like it it's we've almost got two jobs to do and I think it's you and me and anybody listening to this, which is you don't have to necessarily feel like you have to educate people on exactly how to use the tool, right?

Play from 0:56:34 8:88:88 0:56:34 Yeah. Okay. Let me put this in marketing terms. I don't because I'm a leading a marketing team does not need mean that I need to know how to be an SEO expert, right? If I if I have that skill, that's great, but I don't need to I don't have to do that. What I have to know is why I'm doing it and why it's important, right? And the use cases it has and the value it has. Same with, you know, a website build out. I I don't need to be the one building it per se, but I need to know why I need a website and, you know, why user experience is important, right? And all those things.

Play from 0:57:05 8:88:88 0:57:05 This is This is similar, right? So, if you're having these conversations with somebody else, if they don't they may not necessarily have or the want to be a user, right? But they do need to understand the value, they do need to understand the use cases, and the and the place that um this this kind of tech belongs in now, in the future, etc. And I think that's where you hang your hat at the end of the day. So, as we wrap this up like that's I think uh, you know, just my important note that I'm thinking about too is like I I have to remind myself on. Like, not everybody wants to learn this.

Play from 0:57:38 8:88:88 0:57:38 Yeah. Right? Same with Photoshop. Not everybody's going to be a Photoshop expert. You know, but you do know that like designers use Photoshop and why it's important, right? So. It's it's important. I just think it's like good to build these skills in any way, shape, or form because I feel like one tool translates to the others. You know, like I think learning ChatGPT for people is probably not because you have to, just because if you know how that tool works, you know how cloud works. You know how llama works. You know how they all work, right? It's like it's like once you used a, you know, laptop for the first time, you know, use a Mac, you could use an IBM laptop. Like, it's really not that different. There's subtle intricacies, but you just know how to use a tool. So, to me it's just getting on this stuff and knowing that it's going to be it's going to be part of our lives in some way, shape, or

Play from 0:58:23 8:88:88 0:58:23 form. You know, I don't I don't know what to what extent it looks like in 10 years, but at this point we all know it's going to be part of it. You're going to have, you know, your jobs are going to kind of probably be moved into this direction in some way, shape, or form. You're going to use it in some tool in some fashion. And then, you know, there's there's a lot of companies that just embraced it. They just took it and was like, "Screw it. This is what's happening. Like, it could replace us or we could make it, you know, a bionic part of our business and make it actually look a different revenue stream or a different arm of our business and see how it integrates." So, you know, kudos to the people that just like said, "Screw it. Like, we're just going all in because again, it's going to help. It can only help. I you know, again, I I I have probably some apocalyptic thoughts on more of like the ChatGPT side than I do Midjourney.

Play from 0:59:08 8:88:88 0:59:08 But, um, you know, I I I think uh it's pretty interesting, especially where Midjourney could go and just like the future of what it could be cuz I think it's, you know, again, not to go too off topic here. I just love the fact also that this kind of creativity has been put in the hands of like me. Not someone who works at Google, not someone who works at Nvidia. Me. Stupid little me who can, you know, pay $20, $30 a month and do whatever the hell I want. So, that to me is is priceless because you look at what's going to happen with, you know, democratizing creativity. Right? We're now you know, this is why I think Hollywood probably feels like they're in trouble, which is, you know, again, now independent creator, if you have a vision and a

Play from 0:59:54 8:88:88 0:59:54 story to tell, you have the tools. You know, back then it was you had to have the production capacity, the tools, the financing, you had to have, you know, get like basically everything approved by a studio, whatever. So, now you have that and if you have distribution or an audience, you can create your own little channel. You don't have to rely on someone like Hollywood for expensive camera in the world. You don't need a whole crew necessarily. Like, you don't need a whole space you have to rent out or buy out. You know, like, yeah, it's the same like idea too like with with the photography thing that I've I've told you many times. Like, I don't have to have all my gear, take it all out, half the time to drive down here, find parking, you know, blah blah blah blah blah. But, I dude, I think

Play from 1:00:40 8:88:88 1:00:40 that's the perfect way to kind of conclude this episode because I feel like we've we've really talked around everything as it relates to our interest, why we got in this, you know, AI visuals at large, the impact, the use cases, you know, how to maybe view these things. Um, do you have anything else that you think uh you want to drop before we we dip?

Play from 1:01:06 8:88:88 1:01:06 I don't know. I think that was pretty good. I think we went on a good good little little run around there. to end there. Yeah, I mean, that was That was dope. It's our first shot, guys. Give us a freaking break, all right? Yeah, please. Please. Please. Please. And and Midjourney, no more no more drops when we're on the go. Check with us first so we're in a good place and we're safe. So. No Friday night 12:00 p.m. drops, you know. Or if we're traveling or traveling abroad, forget it. Wait till next week.

Play from 1:01:33 8:88:88 1:01:33 If you can if you can consult us, maybe. Just on, you know, a perfect time. That'd be awesome. But it's uh I'm I'm waiting for I'm really looking forward to version 6.5 just to just to have like the the like butterflies in my belly. Let's get it. Let's get it. Dude, I'm I'm ready for that. A little bit of all the nervousness. appearance, all the little the little extras.

Play from 1:01:59 8:88:88 1:01:59 Well, hey. Thanks for joining us on on episode one. I mean, we're banging this thing out. Um you got some You got something Are you raising your hand or are you just saying that? No, that was just episode one. That was episode one. We're going to keep going from here. Hey, we're we're only going up from here. I think this is like a much-needed space for this space. Um we're just thankful to be a part of you know, your preference to to take in this info and we're happy to share everything that we know. So, join us as we go through this journey together. Let's kind of keep going through this and and ride the wave.

Play from 1:02:31 8:88:88 1:02:31 Let's do it. We'll catch you guys next time. Later.